Slavoj Žižek: "I am totally against authenticity" (Podcast 2023, Englisch)
Interview · Renitzc Kantart ·
2023 · 1:12:43 · 11,208 words
ideologyfascism-populismliberalism-political-correctnesspsychoanalysisecology-climatesexuality-gendergeopolitics-wardemocracycapitalismcinema-art-culturehistorysubjectivity
Žižek critiques the contemporary 'woke' left for its self-destructive division and complicity with establishment power, arguing that its focus on identity politics has opened space for right-wing populism. He analyzes the phenomenon of 'unholy alliances' between the far-right and far-left (e.g., anti-NATO sentiments) and the convergence of conservative fundamentalism and progressive censorship. Drawing on Robespierre, Sanders, and psychoanalysis, he argues for a necessary, paradoxical form of authoritarian coordination to address global crises like climate change, while reinterpreting sexual difference and trans identity through a Lacanian lens of constitutive trauma rather than social construction. Žižek and his interlocutor discuss the paradoxes of modern freedom, arguing that true radical freedom is not the ability to choose but the experience of fate in love. They critique the 'cynical reason' of contemporary politics, where knowing the truth does not change the system, and analyze the changing nature of the working class under techno-feudalism. The conversation moves through psychoanalytic views on love and acting, the aesthetics of Balkan culture, and the exhaustion of modern labor, concluding with a defense of the proletariat against identity politics.
every located moment in this recording, click one to read it
The ideas in it 16
in the order they first come up; click a row for what he does with the idea here
as “authenticity”
The psychoanalytic notion that behind social games lies a 'real self'; Žižek rejects this, viewing the confrontation with this horror as a nightmare to be avoided via politeness.
as “sincere hypocrisy”
The nicest aspect of civilization is not authenticity but the polite maintenance of social bonds through hypocritical rituals, which protects us from the horror of a 'true' deep identity.
The convergence of opposite sides (e.g., woke pseudo-left and old right) using identical procedures of brutal censorship and exclusion in the name of freedom.
A Leninist method of analyzing specific historical situations to determine appropriate political action, rather than applying dogmatic rules.
as “axis of evil”
A new political axis comprising Slovenia (Janša), Hungary (Orbán), and Poland, which fights Western imperialism by deconstructing identity and mobilizing fear.
as “no sexual relationship”
The Lacanian concept that sexual difference is not a harmonious binary but a constitutive gap, flaw, or antagonism in human identity.
as “sich verlieben”
The German reflexive term for 'falling in love,' which Žižek uses to argue that love is not a calculated choice but a contingent 'fall' into fate.
The state where one knows the truth (e.g., about climate or inequality) but continues to act as if it doesn't matter, rendering ideological explanations inefficient.
Žižek's self-description as someone who identifies critically with the system's demands, hyperactive in maintaining the status quo while knowing it is flawed.
as “pop-culturalization of political thinking”
The phenomenon where cultural figures (like musicians or artists) become political agents, yet their 'subversion' is absorbed by the establishment without changing material conditions.
as “creative catastrophe”
Žižek's preferred state of being: obsession and workaholism that leads to exhaustion but also creative success, as opposed to 'balanced' well-being.
The subtitle of his new book, ironically referencing Maimonides' 'Perplexed'; Žižek argues we need to be more perplexed and confused to find calm.
as “Mehrlust”
A term from his book (likely 'Multilust' or 'Surplus Enjoyment') referring to the enjoyment derived from the failure of plans and the disruption of order.
A proposed economic era where capitalists dominate not by exploiting workers, but by privatizing the commons and charging rent for participation in social space (e.g., Bill Gates).
A proto-fascist strategy where the working class is granted recognition of their identity and way of life, thereby denying them their program of universal emancipation.
Implied in the discussion of how the system works regardless of what we say; the abstract logic of capital operates independently of subjective belief.
Stories he reaches for 4
Bill Gates became rich not by exploiting workers, but by privatizing the commons and charging rent for social participation, illustrating the shift to techno-feudalism.
“How did he become so rich? Not by overexploiting his workers... But by privatizing a certain commons, social space, in order to participate in social space we pay him a rent.”
Žižek cites Robespierre's 'No freedom for the enemies of freedom' to argue that the modern woke left and old right use identical brutal censorship, excluding enemies in the name of freedom.
“Keine Freiheit für die Feinde der Freiheit. No freedom for the enemies of freedom.”
In Germany, a member of the far-right AfD shouted 'Come to us' at Sahra Wagenknecht (far-left), illustrating an 'unholy alliance' pact between extreme right and left against NATO/Ukraine.
“Sahra Wagenknecht gave a speech and one member of AfD shouted at her 'Kommen Sie zu uns.'”
Steve Bannon openly proclaims himself a Leninist, wanting to destroy the state apparatus. Žižek notes the tragedy that the new right has 'stolen the revolution' from the left.
“Steve Bannon, the main ideologist of Trumpism, he openly ironically of course proclaims himself a Leninist.”
Works invoked 10
Vertigo film
Used to illustrate the difference between love as projection (Stewart) and love as accepting the other's radical otherness (Judy).
Antigone play
Staged by Mateja Koležnik; used to discuss the traumatic nature of sexual difference and trans identity.
Underground film
Kusturica's film, criticized for staging Balkan mythology for the West.
Christian Atheism book
A book Žižek recently delivered the manuscript for.
By Maimonides, ironically referenced in the subtitle of Žižek's new book.
Die Müdigkeit book
Byung-Chul Han's book on exhaustion, used to contrast with Žižek's view on creative exhaustion.
Freiheit book
A new, shorter book by Žižek on freedom.
The podcast title, produced by Hessischer Rundfunk.
Mehrlust book
A book by the interlocutor that Žižek found difficult to finish but eventually completed.
Used as an anecdotal setpiece to illustrate the self-contradictory structure of sexuality and the need for fantasy support.
People invoked 31
Eva Wiseman positive
The Guardian writer who reported the porn documentary anecdote about the iPhone.
Mahatma Gandhi negative
Žižek learned to be critical of Gandhi among leftists in India.
Actor in Vertigo, used as an example of the male chauvinist stance of projecting an image onto a woman.
German Minister of Economy trying to implement new heating methods, cited as an example of elite authority.
Moshe ben Maimon positive
Author of 'A Guide for the Perplexed'; Žižek ironically references him for his book subtitle.
Vladimir Lenin positive
Cited for 'concrete analysis of concrete' and the idea of destroying the state apparatus.
Steve Bannon negative
Described as the 'main ideologist of Trumpism' who ironically proclaims himself a Leninist; used to illustrate how the right steals revolutionary tactics.
Jacques Lacan positive
Referenced via the concept 'there is no sexual relationship' to explain the gap in sexual identity.
Mateja Koležnik positive
Slovenian director who staged Antigone; cited to illustrate the traumatic nature of sexual difference.
Neil Gaiman positive
Quoted by the interlocutor regarding the nature of love and work.
Arundhati Roy positive
Speaks critically about Gandhi in the interlocutor's podcast.
Donald Trump negative
Described as a 'dark cloud storm' and the beneficiary of the liberal left's failure.
Referenced in the context of protests in France that prevented him from going to Davos.
Bernard-Henri Lévy negative
Blamed by Kusturica, along with Žižek, for ruining his Hollywood career.
Marlon Brando negative
Representative of the 'Actor Studio' method which Žižek hates; he prefers Cary Grant.
Bernie Sanders positive
One of Žižek's 'few ideal persons'; praised for his 'moment of genius' in targeting Trump's voters rather than middle liberals.
Maximilien Robespierre positive
Cited for the quote 'No freedom for the enemies of freedom,' which Žižek uses to analyze modern censorship.
Peter Sloterdijk positive
Friend who proposed the formula of 'cynical reason'; Žižek defends him against being denounced as a right-winger.
Byung-Chul Han positive
Korean philosopher who wrote 'Die Müdigkeit' (The Fatigue); Žižek debates him on the nature of exhaustion.
Bill Gates positive
Used as an 'eternal example' of techno-feudalism, becoming rich by privatizing the commons and charging rent.
Janez Janša negative
Cited as part of the 'axis of evil' in Slovenia.
Viktor Orbán negative
Cited as using a strategy of fighting Western imperialism by deconstructing identity and mobilizing fear.
Jordan Peterson negative
Described as 'crazy pro-Putin' now, but previously used by Žižek to target his followers with a 'better' version of responsibility.
Alfred Hitchcock positive
Cited for his film Vertigo to illustrate the distinction between love as projection (James Stewart) and love as accepting the other's otherness (Judy/Madeleine).
Leonid Brezhnev positive
Cited from a history of the Brezhnev era to illustrate the inefficiency and chaos of the old Soviet system.
Sahra Wagenknecht positive
Cited in the context of the 'unholy alliance' between the far-left and far-right in Germany.
Vladimir Putin negative
Described as representing a form of Soviet Union; despised by Žižek.
Hanns Eisler positive
Described as the 'true pupil of Schönberg' and the 'impossible ideal of pupil' compared to Berg and Webern.
Cary Grant positive
Žižek's ideal actor: cold, just acting, no identification, representing the distance of acting.
Sigmund Freud positive
Cited for the psychoanalytic view that sexuality is constitutively traumatic and self-contradictory.
Emir Kusturica negative
Balkan director whose film 'Underground' stages Balkan mythology for the West; Žižek hates him and blames him for ruining his own Hollywood success.
Transcript 153 turns
Slavoj Žižek
I am totally against authenticity, because authenticity presupposes that behind all the games you are playing, you have some deep identity, the real yourself. Maybe there is something like this, but I prefer not to know about it. It's horrible, it's nightmare. And this is, you know, the lesson of psychoanalysis. It's not become who you truly are. The lesson of psychoanalysis is just to confront briefly that horror so that then you again acquire a distance from it. I don't believe again in this be open, say everything. I believe in politeness. I think the nicest thing about civilization is this what I call sincere hypocrisy.
I am totally against authenticity, because authenticity presupposes that behind all the games you are playing, you have some deep identity, the real yourself. Maybe there is something like this, but I prefer not to know about it. It's horrible, it's nightmare. And this is, you know, the lesson of psychoanalysis. It's not become who you truly are. The lesson of psychoanalysis is just to confront briefly that horror so that then you again acquire a distance from it. I don't believe again in this be open, say everything. I believe in politeness. I think the nicest thing about civilization is this what I call sincere hypocrisy.
unknown
Birds flying high you know how I feel. Sun in the sky you know how I feel. Breeze drifting on by you know how I feel.
Birds flying high you know how I feel. Sun in the sky you know how I feel. Breeze drifting on by you know how I feel.
unknown
Welcome to my podcast Freedom Deluxe. My name is Jagoda Marinić. I'm a writer and a columnist and host of this show. My guests are people who shape debates, make us think about freedom in different ways, or who simply inspire me by the way they are in public. My today's guest is somebody whose public persona has shaped my thinking for twenty years. Slavoj Žižek has been Slavoj Žižek for decades now. Thought-provoking, disturbing, and for some disquieting. Even the sheer fact that he has a nose tic is for some people something they can't get over. His tremendous success has brought him much criticism and envy, but more so prestigious titles such as the most dangerous philosopher of the world. He's a professor at the University of Ljubljana. He has written a great new book, Surplus Enjoyment: A Guide for the Non-Perplexed. In German it's called Die Paradoxien der Mehrlust. He is Slovenia's most prominent person right after Melania Trump and I am happy to have him here on the show. Welcome, Slavoj Žižek.
Welcome to my podcast Freedom Deluxe. My name is Jagoda Marinić. I'm a writer and a columnist and host of this show. My guests are people who shape debates, make us think about freedom in different ways, or who simply inspire me by the way they are in public. My today's guest is somebody whose public persona has shaped my thinking for twenty years. Slavoj Žižek has been Slavoj Žižek for decades now. Thought-provoking, disturbing, and for some disquieting. Even the sheer fact that he has a nose tic is for some people something they can't get over. His tremendous success has brought him much criticism and envy, but more so prestigious titles such as the most dangerous philosopher of the world. He's a professor at the University of Ljubljana. He has written a great new book, Surplus Enjoyment: A Guide for the Non-Perplexed. In German it's called Die Paradoxien der Mehrlust. He is Slovenia's most prominent person right after Melania Trump and I am happy to have him here on the show. Welcome, Slavoj Žižek.
Slavoj Žižek
Welcome and I'm very glad to be here. After all these crazy people that I meet, finally I can speak in a normal dirty way with a normal person.
Welcome and I'm very glad to be here. After all these crazy people that I meet, finally I can speak in a normal dirty way with a normal person.
unknown
Thank you Slavoj. I ja se osjećam ono predobro, predobro da si tu.
Thank you Slavoj. I ja se osjećam ono predobro, predobro da si tu.
Slavoj Žižek
To nije dobro. Ne dobro. Biće
To nije dobro. Ne dobro. Biće
unknown
loše, biće hajme, biće hajme. Like everybody, I have asked you to bring a quote on freedom that you would like to start the conversation with. What is your quote
loše, biće hajme, biće hajme. Like everybody, I have asked you to bring a quote on freedom that you would like to start the conversation with. What is your quote
Slavoj Žižek
on freedom? It will appear again one of my postmodern stupid provocations, but my favorite quote on freedom is, I think it was not Saint-Just but Robespierre, who said, "Keine Freiheit für die Feinde der Freiheit." No freedom for the enemies of freedom. Now we think this is an old eccentricity, but listen, aren't we today experiencing this stance in a way which is much more radical than under so-called Jacobin terror? Look what is now happening. This is for me one of the sad things today. Did you read maybe in newspapers a couple of days ago in Salt Lake City, Mormons, they prohibited in elementary and high schools, prohibited the Bible, claiming that there are too many obscenities, violence and so on. And you know what makes me sad, that it's not clear who did this. Were these really Christian fundamentalists for whom even the Bible is too much in Bible as literally a text, or was this a leftist ironic provocation? But I think it doesn't matter. Here is one case of what I call today's unholy alliances. The opposite sides, in this case the woke pseudo-left and the old right are using the same procedure. Both they officially fight for freedom, but they use the same method of brutal censoring. Accusing each other of fascism, terror and so on. This is very sad. So this Robespierre's "no freedom for enemies of freedom", this is happening. This is happening in Florida, in Kansas and so on, and the new left is doing this. Certain topics, like I was accused, immediately I will give you back the word. No no, I was accused of being fascist recently at a round table where all I said was that to say that trans women are also simply women, I said, yes, the same rights and so on, but it's not so simple. For this I was accused of being a fascist. So you see how always be attentive when you have a violent struggle what is excluded on behalf of freedom. This is today more than ever our reality.
on freedom? It will appear again one of my postmodern stupid provocations, but my favorite quote on freedom is, I think it was not Saint-Just but Robespierre, who said, "Keine Freiheit für die Feinde der Freiheit." No freedom for the enemies of freedom. Now we think this is an old eccentricity, but listen, aren't we today experiencing this stance in a way which is much more radical than under so-called Jacobin terror? Look what is now happening. This is for me one of the sad things today. Did you read maybe in newspapers a couple of days ago in Salt Lake City, Mormons, they prohibited in elementary and high schools, prohibited the Bible, claiming that there are too many obscenities, violence and so on. And you know what makes me sad, that it's not clear who did this. Were these really Christian fundamentalists for whom even the Bible is too much in Bible as literally a text, or was this a leftist ironic provocation? But I think it doesn't matter. Here is one case of what I call today's unholy alliances. The opposite sides, in this case the woke pseudo-left and the old right are using the same procedure. Both they officially fight for freedom, but they use the same method of brutal censoring. Accusing each other of fascism, terror and so on. This is very sad. So this Robespierre's "no freedom for enemies of freedom", this is happening. This is happening in Florida, in Kansas and so on, and the new left is doing this. Certain topics, like I was accused, immediately I will give you back the word. No no, I was accused of being fascist recently at a round table where all I said was that to say that trans women are also simply women, I said, yes, the same rights and so on, but it's not so simple. For this I was accused of being a fascist. So you see how always be attentive when you have a violent struggle what is excluded on behalf of freedom. This is today more than ever our reality.
unknown
Yeah, I understand and I often see the same problem also because I come from an emancipation movement myself. I'm a kid of the working class of migrants, so I needed a lot of the material to make public topics. But I still observe similar things like you in the radicalization of the movement. And yet do you think it makes a difference when you compare like alt-right and the radical left or woke? You say they are not, they are woke in a woke is a fake awake is what you write in your book. It's woke but fake awake. And but do you think it's a difference? I mean the alt-right intend to with their means they have like an unhuman agenda, you know? They want less human rights, they want something, humiliate people, discriminate people, take away their rights. But the radical left, even if they're radical, they at least have a good agenda in mind. They want people to be accepted, they want every trans person to be treated the same way. Do you see a difference in the intention, you compare
Yeah, I understand and I often see the same problem also because I come from an emancipation movement myself. I'm a kid of the working class of migrants, so I needed a lot of the material to make public topics. But I still observe similar things like you in the radicalization of the movement. And yet do you think it makes a difference when you compare like alt-right and the radical left or woke? You say they are not, they are woke in a woke is a fake awake is what you write in your book. It's woke but fake awake. And but do you think it's a difference? I mean the alt-right intend to with their means they have like an unhuman agenda, you know? They want less human rights, they want something, humiliate people, discriminate people, take away their rights. But the radical left, even if they're radical, they at least have a good agenda in mind. They want people to be accepted, they want every trans person to be treated the same way. Do you see a difference in the intention, you compare
Slavoj Žižek
it okay? Of course, I mean I, no no, my reproach to the woke left, it's not that I disagree with its goals, but that the very way it proceeds often undermines its official goals. For example, you know one of my few, very short, one of my few ideal persons Bernie Sanders, he said very nicely that the problem with some extreme woke ideologist is that instead of aiming at some kind of as wide as possible solidarity, they enact although they speak about understanding, recognition, they often enact extreme division. Like, you know these are typical woke polemics. Are you not sure that you were a little bit racist with that expression and so on? This is the tragedy. That's why I'm sometimes ready to go as far as to say certain functioning of woke ideology fits establishment perfectly, because the way woke function it is a perfect way to prevent even elementary proposals of some large coalition. No, they always bring division and they are also very self-destructive. They have all these demands, trans and so on, but I didn't hear from them of any idea of what kind of society they want. Do they want to overcome capitalism? Do they want this, that? It's not a stance which can bring us out of this crisis towards a new society. In your book you even say the time when Trump soared in polls was actually the time when the left was talking about toilets back there. No, this was just before election. Yeah right. I find it so shocking. The America, United States was in turmoil, everybody saw this dark cloud storm Trump coming, and what were the title Geschichten stories in New York Times? This problem of what to do with trans people in toilets, big debates, do we need separate toilets for them, just one universal toilet or whatever. This is for me the tragedy is this one. And that's the tragedy of today's liberalism. It is so clear that it's more and more becoming upper middle class movement. It even has this class dimension. If they are honest, they will say who is today really anti-feminist and so on? Ah, many of them are working class and so on. You know I am totally against Trump, that's in the same way as I am against Putin now and so on. But we should never forget that the space for Trump was open through the failure and hypocrisy of the predominant multicultural liberal left. And do you think it's the same reason now in Europe, in Germany, because we also have the right parties rising? That it's a failure of the liberal or the radical left or the left in itself? But we don't even have, that's the problem, an authentic radical left. There was an attempt, which still I think it was a miracle, you remember when was it, five six years ago, the moment of Syriza in Greece? It was incredible. A radical left, it was an ideal combination between the party and multitude of feminist and other local social movements. But then the tragedy occurred. And what was the tragedy? That the Syriza government itself has even to use police to destroy its own civil society
it okay? Of course, I mean I, no no, my reproach to the woke left, it's not that I disagree with its goals, but that the very way it proceeds often undermines its official goals. For example, you know one of my few, very short, one of my few ideal persons Bernie Sanders, he said very nicely that the problem with some extreme woke ideologist is that instead of aiming at some kind of as wide as possible solidarity, they enact although they speak about understanding, recognition, they often enact extreme division. Like, you know these are typical woke polemics. Are you not sure that you were a little bit racist with that expression and so on? This is the tragedy. That's why I'm sometimes ready to go as far as to say certain functioning of woke ideology fits establishment perfectly, because the way woke function it is a perfect way to prevent even elementary proposals of some large coalition. No, they always bring division and they are also very self-destructive. They have all these demands, trans and so on, but I didn't hear from them of any idea of what kind of society they want. Do they want to overcome capitalism? Do they want this, that? It's not a stance which can bring us out of this crisis towards a new society. In your book you even say the time when Trump soared in polls was actually the time when the left was talking about toilets back there. No, this was just before election. Yeah right. I find it so shocking. The America, United States was in turmoil, everybody saw this dark cloud storm Trump coming, and what were the title Geschichten stories in New York Times? This problem of what to do with trans people in toilets, big debates, do we need separate toilets for them, just one universal toilet or whatever. This is for me the tragedy is this one. And that's the tragedy of today's liberalism. It is so clear that it's more and more becoming upper middle class movement. It even has this class dimension. If they are honest, they will say who is today really anti-feminist and so on? Ah, many of them are working class and so on. You know I am totally against Trump, that's in the same way as I am against Putin now and so on. But we should never forget that the space for Trump was open through the failure and hypocrisy of the predominant multicultural liberal left. And do you think it's the same reason now in Europe, in Germany, because we also have the right parties rising? That it's a failure of the liberal or the radical left or the left in itself? But we don't even have, that's the problem, an authentic radical left. There was an attempt, which still I think it was a miracle, you remember when was it, five six years ago, the moment of Syriza in Greece? It was incredible. A radical left, it was an ideal combination between the party and multitude of feminist and other local social movements. But then the tragedy occurred. And what was the tragedy? That the Syriza government itself has even to use police to destroy its own civil society
unknown
foundations. And it's really a problem, another anecdote that I often use. That's also interesting, just because, sorry please. Yeah. They
foundations. And it's really a problem, another anecdote that I often use. That's also interesting, just because, sorry please. Yeah. They
Slavoj Žižek
need the police to destroy their own civil society foundations? Because you know in what sense? Yeah, but that's super interesting, let me just say, because in Germany we also have that. We have the Letzte Generation, which is young people who sort of demonstrate in on highways, you know they use, you know to glue themselves, they glue themselves on the highways and the police is very rigid in criminalizing all these civil society movements. So you see there's a pattern of the police destroying... No, the tragedy is this one. Okay, the saddest one of when I almost cried was you remember, everybody does, 6th of January two years ago when the Trump crowd entered occupied Congress. My friends old leftists were crying. You know why? Because they said what's happening? We should be doing this. So has the new right stole even the revolution? That's the dream of every leftist popular uprising people break into and even you know Steve Bannon, the main ideologist of Trumpism, he openly ironically of course proclaims himself a Leninist. He said the state apparatus the way we have it has to be destroyed. And you know what's the tragedy? Before he goes into all his racist illusions he usually begins in a very
need the police to destroy their own civil society foundations? Because you know in what sense? Yeah, but that's super interesting, let me just say, because in Germany we also have that. We have the Letzte Generation, which is young people who sort of demonstrate in on highways, you know they use, you know to glue themselves, they glue themselves on the highways and the police is very rigid in criminalizing all these civil society movements. So you see there's a pattern of the police destroying... No, the tragedy is this one. Okay, the saddest one of when I almost cried was you remember, everybody does, 6th of January two years ago when the Trump crowd entered occupied Congress. My friends old leftists were crying. You know why? Because they said what's happening? We should be doing this. So has the new right stole even the revolution? That's the dream of every leftist popular uprising people break into and even you know Steve Bannon, the main ideologist of Trumpism, he openly ironically of course proclaims himself a Leninist. He said the state apparatus the way we have it has to be destroyed. And you know what's the tragedy? Before he goes into all his racist illusions he usually begins in a very
unknown
good way. He said those who are ruling really ruling us today are big corporations combined with state administration. Here we will not have time to cover all of this, but here I think I find it very interesting
good way. He said those who are ruling really ruling us today are big corporations combined with state administration. Here we will not have time to cover all of this, but here I think I find it very interesting
Slavoj Žižek
although I don't accept them. This notion that liberal capitalism is already disappearing, that we are entering something that we can call techno-feudalism or what. For example, my eternal example, Bill Gates. How did he become so rich? Not by overexploiting his workers. He pays them relatively well. But by privatizing a certain commons, social space, in order to participate in social space we pay him a rent. Capitalism to rent and this is what I must say Steve Bannon sees clearly, that today in some sense capitalists small it's illusory to say this but let me say it, small individual creative capitalists and workers and so on, they are both more and more dominated by a new feudal class. And you know
although I don't accept them. This notion that liberal capitalism is already disappearing, that we are entering something that we can call techno-feudalism or what. For example, my eternal example, Bill Gates. How did he become so rich? Not by overexploiting his workers. He pays them relatively well. But by privatizing a certain commons, social space, in order to participate in social space we pay him a rent. Capitalism to rent and this is what I must say Steve Bannon sees clearly, that today in some sense capitalists small it's illusory to say this but let me say it, small individual creative capitalists and workers and so on, they are both more and more dominated by a new feudal class. And you know
unknown
who sees this clearly? I'm not simply against him. The new Chinese power
who sees this clearly? I'm not simply against him. The new Chinese power
Slavoj Žižek
Xi and the new gang, they made it very clear, they are not old Maoist totalitarians. They are totalitarian no, they just
Xi and the new gang, they made it very clear, they are not old Maoist totalitarians. They are totalitarian no, they just
unknown
see the danger in this mega new oligarchic feudal answer. So this is what we are missing today. The left is caught into this blah blah global neoliberalism, no it's already dying out. Something is replacing global capitalism, something which is maybe even worse. To come to this thought when you said that the left is not capable of like creating a policy that will connect a lot of people but is like disrupting itself. But then for example you said Bernie Sanders, he for example
see the danger in this mega new oligarchic feudal answer. So this is what we are missing today. The left is caught into this blah blah global neoliberalism, no it's already dying out. Something is replacing global capitalism, something which is maybe even worse. To come to this thought when you said that the left is not capable of like creating a policy that will connect a lot of people but is like disrupting itself. But then for example you said Bernie Sanders, he for example
Slavoj Žižek
will not address the issue of gun control because he's afraid that he would lose too many voters. In Vermont, yeah. But I find this a totally acceptable compromise. So how much compromise can the left do or should the left do? It depends, I will be a Leninist here, concrete analysis of concrete, but something Sanders saw very well. This was his moment of genius. You know Democratic Party was obsessed with this idea if we move too much to the left we will lose those undecided in the middle. And Sanders got the lesson for Trump. Trump moved radically to rightist politics and won in this way. So what was Bernie Sanders' message? He said it explicitly. He said that our aim is not to get those middle of the road liberals, our game is to get Trump's voters, the disappointed working class, to convince them. And you know where I followed, to go into more fashionable waters, the same strategy? I think it worked, I made it very clear. You know my, it was ridiculous but nonetheless my big under quotation marks debate with Jordan Peterson. I said there openly and later, my task was not to destroy him, but to show to his followers that what he is really preaching and some elements, not now now he got crazy pro-Putin and so on, but when he said, you know, don't just play a victim, take responsibility, I asserted that we the left can do it better than he himself. I was aiming at his followers. Then he was silent, all his illness problems, Jordan Peterson for one two years and now he returned is back in a much worse image, I mean. You just said that the idea is to get back the voters, from that are voting Trump and how can you get back the disappointed? On the other hand in Germany there's a lot of science about the people who are voting far right and they say that these people actually have a stable autocratic mindset. That they are not that it's not easy to get them back because that's seriously how they think about the world. Do you think this? Now you will get a provocation from me. Do it. Maybe, maybe we need a mind which would be in a good sense, we have time maybe to talk, a little bit more autocratic. Now my first thesis here to really provoke things. It's not just those who vote for AfD. Most of the people, they want the appearance of democracy. They should be asked, they vote, but they want to be discreetly told what choice to make. I think that people would be afraid to now you really have to decide. No, people are totally confused today. They need somebody, I say this with all the paradoxes, they need, we come back at the paradox of freedom, they want to appear to be free, but they need somebody to tell them clearly what to do, how to act and so on. And with the complexity of today's situation, I accept this, another argument for under quotation marks more authoritarian set of mind. I of course don't mean a new in DDR SED Central Committee, no, they were terribly inefficient. You know what was? I read a wonderful history of Soviet Union in Brezhnev era and it demonstrated so convincingly, you know
will not address the issue of gun control because he's afraid that he would lose too many voters. In Vermont, yeah. But I find this a totally acceptable compromise. So how much compromise can the left do or should the left do? It depends, I will be a Leninist here, concrete analysis of concrete, but something Sanders saw very well. This was his moment of genius. You know Democratic Party was obsessed with this idea if we move too much to the left we will lose those undecided in the middle. And Sanders got the lesson for Trump. Trump moved radically to rightist politics and won in this way. So what was Bernie Sanders' message? He said it explicitly. He said that our aim is not to get those middle of the road liberals, our game is to get Trump's voters, the disappointed working class, to convince them. And you know where I followed, to go into more fashionable waters, the same strategy? I think it worked, I made it very clear. You know my, it was ridiculous but nonetheless my big under quotation marks debate with Jordan Peterson. I said there openly and later, my task was not to destroy him, but to show to his followers that what he is really preaching and some elements, not now now he got crazy pro-Putin and so on, but when he said, you know, don't just play a victim, take responsibility, I asserted that we the left can do it better than he himself. I was aiming at his followers. Then he was silent, all his illness problems, Jordan Peterson for one two years and now he returned is back in a much worse image, I mean. You just said that the idea is to get back the voters, from that are voting Trump and how can you get back the disappointed? On the other hand in Germany there's a lot of science about the people who are voting far right and they say that these people actually have a stable autocratic mindset. That they are not that it's not easy to get them back because that's seriously how they think about the world. Do you think this? Now you will get a provocation from me. Do it. Maybe, maybe we need a mind which would be in a good sense, we have time maybe to talk, a little bit more autocratic. Now my first thesis here to really provoke things. It's not just those who vote for AfD. Most of the people, they want the appearance of democracy. They should be asked, they vote, but they want to be discreetly told what choice to make. I think that people would be afraid to now you really have to decide. No, people are totally confused today. They need somebody, I say this with all the paradoxes, they need, we come back at the paradox of freedom, they want to appear to be free, but they need somebody to tell them clearly what to do, how to act and so on. And with the complexity of today's situation, I accept this, another argument for under quotation marks more authoritarian set of mind. I of course don't mean a new in DDR SED Central Committee, no, they were terribly inefficient. You know what was? I read a wonderful history of Soviet Union in Brezhnev era and it demonstrated so convincingly, you know
unknown
there is this myth the West is liberal but too chaotic, Soviet Union was oppressive organized but oppressive. No, beneath the surface already in Stalinism communist countries were beneath the surface extremely
there is this myth the West is liberal but too chaotic, Soviet Union was oppressive organized but oppressive. No, beneath the surface already in Stalinism communist countries were beneath the surface extremely
Slavoj Žižek
chaotic. You had to bribe, nothing works, so in this sense the paradox is we have to get the lesson. Compare
chaotic. You had to bribe, nothing works, so in this sense the paradox is we have to get the lesson. Compare
unknown
today Putin's Russia and let's say they're not as ideal as they appear but still some kind of a model I don't know Sweden, Norway and so
today Putin's Russia and let's say they're not as ideal as they appear but still some kind of a model I don't know Sweden, Norway and so
Slavoj Žižek
on. They are still liberal societies but they are much better organized, even controlled I would say. Why do we need this? Another sad moment for me, this really made me afraid. You remember not last summer one before that terrible heatwave in parts of the world which we consider cold? That axis Seattle-Vancouver, Northwest United States, Southwest of Canada. Temperatures reached degrees there, the usual Arab Emirates temperatures. And you know what was clear to me then? You cannot play there what still many leftists like to do local democracy, ah local people there, no at the level of ecological care they were doing pretty well. The problem is global. The problem is that the whole circulation of air towards the north of our earth is deeply perturbed. You can only solve this problem at the level of more general even authoritarian coordination. But be careful here, I hope we all agree, I'm not saying a world government. Can you even imagine what type of corruption this would be. But simply look at global warming. It's clear that measures will have to be global. Look at war with Ukraine and so on. Where again we have this another unholy alliance. Even in Germany, you remember that scene was it in Leipzig or Dresden when Sahra Wagenknecht gave a speech and one member of AfD shouted at her "Kommen Sie zu uns." We're this pact apropos Russian aggression on Ukraine between extreme right and extreme left. Now I don't idealize Ukraine, but I'm saying I despise the leftists who still think that in spite of all differences anybody who opposes NATO should be somehow good and nonetheless Putin represents somehow Soviet Union. No, look
on. They are still liberal societies but they are much better organized, even controlled I would say. Why do we need this? Another sad moment for me, this really made me afraid. You remember not last summer one before that terrible heatwave in parts of the world which we consider cold? That axis Seattle-Vancouver, Northwest United States, Southwest of Canada. Temperatures reached degrees there, the usual Arab Emirates temperatures. And you know what was clear to me then? You cannot play there what still many leftists like to do local democracy, ah local people there, no at the level of ecological care they were doing pretty well. The problem is global. The problem is that the whole circulation of air towards the north of our earth is deeply perturbed. You can only solve this problem at the level of more general even authoritarian coordination. But be careful here, I hope we all agree, I'm not saying a world government. Can you even imagine what type of corruption this would be. But simply look at global warming. It's clear that measures will have to be global. Look at war with Ukraine and so on. Where again we have this another unholy alliance. Even in Germany, you remember that scene was it in Leipzig or Dresden when Sahra Wagenknecht gave a speech and one member of AfD shouted at her "Kommen Sie zu uns." We're this pact apropos Russian aggression on Ukraine between extreme right and extreme left. Now I don't idealize Ukraine, but I'm saying I despise the leftists who still think that in spite of all differences anybody who opposes NATO should be somehow good and nonetheless Putin represents somehow Soviet Union. No, look
unknown
at Putin's ideology, he is openly a neo-fascist. So here we have to precisely, this is another example of this unholy alliances, which really made me sad, even I with all my dirty jokes I get sad. Did you read what happened now a couple of weeks ago in Uganda? Where Parliament accepted and the President signed into law ridiculous punishing for homosexual, if you are caught you can even get shot. But I did something that many people don't do. I looked on the web into their newspapers which
at Putin's ideology, he is openly a neo-fascist. So here we have to precisely, this is another example of this unholy alliances, which really made me sad, even I with all my dirty jokes I get sad. Did you read what happened now a couple of weeks ago in Uganda? Where Parliament accepted and the President signed into law ridiculous punishing for homosexual, if you are caught you can even get shot. But I did something that many people don't do. I looked on the web into their newspapers which
Slavoj Žižek
are English and you know how they justify it? As anti-imperialist struggle. They say either you're with the corrupted West, neocolonialism, imperialism or you are with us. Shooting gays means you are for African emancipation and so on. You see this unholy alliances are the big problem today. And the same strategy that I mean Orbán is using and many others too. They are fighting the imperialism of the West with the deconstruction of identity and they don't care about people and all the fear that causes in the masses of people, right? Yeah yeah yeah. No no, I take this seriously. This possibility of a new axis of evil I call it. Like Slovenia maybe if Janša comes back to power, Slovenia, Hungary, Poland and some in between no? Yeah yeah, but the interesting thing is that many on the left they don't see that it causes fear in people, you know? When you when you have now in, let's say when you look at the Germans for example, no the right they say people are afraid of gendering language, people are afraid of this. They mobilize by by doing culture wars as we call them. But the people who are trying to promote these ideas, they say no that's not the reason. So do you think there's a denial of of also the progressive or the liberal parts, how much fear these the disruptions and the ideas of the last years cause in people? Is it a denial, can't they imagine that something they believe is so right is causing so much fear? And on the other hand isn't that the basic of what our society is, the human rights, aren't they just saying we have to make sure that we are like living our human rights, aren't they in the end just defending their human rights against those who are trying to, I mean if you say they want to shoot a homosexual so. I mean what what is the solution out of this paradox? Okay, of course I'm not only totally against alt-right, I even think that originally at least #MeToo was something incredible. #MeToo is not only just another feminist movement. They in some sense they go even further than Marxism. The Marxist story is with class societies we got patriarchy and blah blah exploitation. But there is a theory behind #MeToo which is I think correct, that the true gap where women become subordinated is already Neolithic society. Permanent settlement, cities with walls. At that point women were subordinated already and relations of domination emerged. So in this sense I totally support #MeToo. Also with trans people. But you know to be more convince, not convincing in a cheap sense, like let's take trans people. I totally support their demands. I am against let's call it binary opposition. But sometimes would you agree or not, I again I try to be as aggressive as I can, they by they I mean those trans people for whom sex is just socially constructed and so on. It is but not in this easy way that I feel a woman so that I am a woman. Didn't they learn anything from psychoanalysis from Freud? First, sexuality I think is constitutively something traumatic, caught in self-contradictions and so on. And it's not simply let me discover who I really am. Often I don't know who I am to be trans. I think for this reason, trans people for me first I believe against trans ideology that sexual difference is more radical than this binary system masculine, feminine. Sexual difference names a certain gap, flaw, which is constitutive of human identity even. This is why maybe you know the story I often repeat but I love it. I read a couple of years ago in The Guardian, a lady called woman lady is patronizing I know, Eva Wiseman was so shocked. This is what story that I always tell when somebody wants me to explain what do I mean by there is no sexual relationship blah blah antagonism. She was watching and I often watch them they are very interesting, I'm not crazy. Not hardcore porn, they are boring, but documentaries about making of hardcore porn. The camera is behind all of them. And she describes Eva a scene where a guy is doing it, hardcore penetrating doing it to the lady. Then in the middle of it he stands up and says "sorry I'm losing erection, can somebody please give me my iPhone so that I go to Pornhub and get excited again?" And she is horrified. She is like "my God you have there a naked woman, you are doing it and you need virtual world to..." but this is the structure of sexuality. It is in itself self-contradictory, self-sabotaging, so that you need some sphere of fantasy ideology. If we are in bed, we are never alone. Each of us has to have a fantasy support and so on. And as we learned from Freud identities are something very contradictory quite often. So for me first trans people are ethically I admit it the highest. Why? Because if you are simply a woman or a man, you think it's perfect, it's harmonious, I know what I want. But the tension contradiction constitutive of sexuality erupts directly with trans people. I agree yeah. But this means let's not simplify sexual identity. You know do you know Mateja Koležnik that Slovenian... She told me, I repeat it somewhere, a horrible story. When she was staging Antigone in Residenztheater in Munich, she wanted to be correct and
are English and you know how they justify it? As anti-imperialist struggle. They say either you're with the corrupted West, neocolonialism, imperialism or you are with us. Shooting gays means you are for African emancipation and so on. You see this unholy alliances are the big problem today. And the same strategy that I mean Orbán is using and many others too. They are fighting the imperialism of the West with the deconstruction of identity and they don't care about people and all the fear that causes in the masses of people, right? Yeah yeah yeah. No no, I take this seriously. This possibility of a new axis of evil I call it. Like Slovenia maybe if Janša comes back to power, Slovenia, Hungary, Poland and some in between no? Yeah yeah, but the interesting thing is that many on the left they don't see that it causes fear in people, you know? When you when you have now in, let's say when you look at the Germans for example, no the right they say people are afraid of gendering language, people are afraid of this. They mobilize by by doing culture wars as we call them. But the people who are trying to promote these ideas, they say no that's not the reason. So do you think there's a denial of of also the progressive or the liberal parts, how much fear these the disruptions and the ideas of the last years cause in people? Is it a denial, can't they imagine that something they believe is so right is causing so much fear? And on the other hand isn't that the basic of what our society is, the human rights, aren't they just saying we have to make sure that we are like living our human rights, aren't they in the end just defending their human rights against those who are trying to, I mean if you say they want to shoot a homosexual so. I mean what what is the solution out of this paradox? Okay, of course I'm not only totally against alt-right, I even think that originally at least #MeToo was something incredible. #MeToo is not only just another feminist movement. They in some sense they go even further than Marxism. The Marxist story is with class societies we got patriarchy and blah blah exploitation. But there is a theory behind #MeToo which is I think correct, that the true gap where women become subordinated is already Neolithic society. Permanent settlement, cities with walls. At that point women were subordinated already and relations of domination emerged. So in this sense I totally support #MeToo. Also with trans people. But you know to be more convince, not convincing in a cheap sense, like let's take trans people. I totally support their demands. I am against let's call it binary opposition. But sometimes would you agree or not, I again I try to be as aggressive as I can, they by they I mean those trans people for whom sex is just socially constructed and so on. It is but not in this easy way that I feel a woman so that I am a woman. Didn't they learn anything from psychoanalysis from Freud? First, sexuality I think is constitutively something traumatic, caught in self-contradictions and so on. And it's not simply let me discover who I really am. Often I don't know who I am to be trans. I think for this reason, trans people for me first I believe against trans ideology that sexual difference is more radical than this binary system masculine, feminine. Sexual difference names a certain gap, flaw, which is constitutive of human identity even. This is why maybe you know the story I often repeat but I love it. I read a couple of years ago in The Guardian, a lady called woman lady is patronizing I know, Eva Wiseman was so shocked. This is what story that I always tell when somebody wants me to explain what do I mean by there is no sexual relationship blah blah antagonism. She was watching and I often watch them they are very interesting, I'm not crazy. Not hardcore porn, they are boring, but documentaries about making of hardcore porn. The camera is behind all of them. And she describes Eva a scene where a guy is doing it, hardcore penetrating doing it to the lady. Then in the middle of it he stands up and says "sorry I'm losing erection, can somebody please give me my iPhone so that I go to Pornhub and get excited again?" And she is horrified. She is like "my God you have there a naked woman, you are doing it and you need virtual world to..." but this is the structure of sexuality. It is in itself self-contradictory, self-sabotaging, so that you need some sphere of fantasy ideology. If we are in bed, we are never alone. Each of us has to have a fantasy support and so on. And as we learned from Freud identities are something very contradictory quite often. So for me first trans people are ethically I admit it the highest. Why? Because if you are simply a woman or a man, you think it's perfect, it's harmonious, I know what I want. But the tension contradiction constitutive of sexuality erupts directly with trans people. I agree yeah. But this means let's not simplify sexual identity. You know do you know Mateja Koležnik that Slovenian... She told me, I repeat it somewhere, a horrible story. When she was staging Antigone in Residenztheater in Munich, she wanted to be correct and
unknown
asked the actors at the beginning so that I will not make mistakes are you she, he, they, tell me. You know what the answer she got from most of them? It's crazy. "You should ask me this question every day. Today I feel a woman, I don't know how I will feel tomorrow, maybe..." No sorry sexual identity
asked the actors at the beginning so that I will not make mistakes are you she, he, they, tell me. You know what the answer she got from most of them? It's crazy. "You should ask me this question every day. Today I feel a woman, I don't know how I will feel tomorrow, maybe..." No sorry sexual identity
Slavoj Žižek
cannot be dismissed as something so easily playful. It's very traumatic. Sex is a problem and I don't buy this myth that once we get rid of the binary oppression, we will simply be glad enjoying our freedom. No
cannot be dismissed as something so easily playful. It's very traumatic. Sex is a problem and I don't buy this myth that once we get rid of the binary oppression, we will simply be glad enjoying our freedom. No
unknown
sex is a dark dangerous thing I would even say. So yes I am, to return to your question, I am sorry I am not for authoritarianism in the wrong sense, but it's clear to confront our problem... You really made it back to the question. I have to be careful. Yeah that's a miracle for me. It's a miracle too. I'm sorry, I'm betraying my true self. You terrorize me. I terrorize you? I can't believe it. No, it was. No I'm I have to be careful first because I am so used to watching you on YouTube that I'm not aware I can stop me
sex is a dark dangerous thing I would even say. So yes I am, to return to your question, I am sorry I am not for authoritarianism in the wrong sense, but it's clear to confront our problem... You really made it back to the question. I have to be careful. Yeah that's a miracle for me. It's a miracle too. I'm sorry, I'm betraying my true self. You terrorize me. I terrorize you? I can't believe it. No, it was. No I'm I have to be careful first because I am so used to watching you on YouTube that I'm not aware I can stop me
unknown
and and intervene and I can ask you. You should be brutal here. I am a man, you know Kant says a human being is an animal who needs a master. I am a man who needs a domina. Oh wow. So. Not in the vulgar sexual sense, but somebody has to stop me. I will try to stop you, but I have to be become aware of the fact that I actually can because I feel like I'm watching you. You, do you know what you are saying now? I'm not kidding. It's very profound. Often people have some liberties but you see that's one of
and and intervene and I can ask you. You should be brutal here. I am a man, you know Kant says a human being is an animal who needs a master. I am a man who needs a domina. Oh wow. So. Not in the vulgar sexual sense, but somebody has to stop me. I will try to stop you, but I have to be become aware of the fact that I actually can because I feel like I'm watching you. You, do you know what you are saying now? I'm not kidding. It's very profound. Often people have some liberties but you see that's one of
Slavoj Žižek
the antagonisms of freedom. They are at a formal level aware that they have these freedoms, but they are at the same time they don't really believe that they can use this freedom. And that's the problem with freedom today. And that's why I will say now something very flat, we will all agree with it I hope. That's why I think that we should remain leftists. Liberalism is a great thing, I don't underestimate personal freedoms, but you know where the left begins? Not with... No no no, I will stop you here. Okay. Because because I'm being in a pro-seminar, you're too good and I have seen thousands of videos and I know so much about you. You're crazy, you're crazy. No no, I'm watching you with your whole theory, TV series. I'm watching your videos since years. I need to find out because you I've read this book and it's crazy. And but in the end you want us in the book in I love the book. Which one? Mehrlust? The last and it's actually the the only one I was able to really finish. The other ones I all had to stop. What changed that I could was able to read a book from you to the end? I'm getting old and I'm living in this doom of maybe this is the last book. So you're getting more and more... Even I am working like crazy. You know there are already two more books. One on Freiheit. Yeah that's why I know so much about Freiheit, freedom. I wrote a new shorter book, pages for me shorter, on freedom. And then another one I just delivered the manuscript on Christian Atheism. Okay let's go on. No no no I know you wrote a hundred books and I love those books on love and we could also talk about love because now that you talk about sexuality and this scene that I also know. I'm here naive, would you agree? Sorry to interrupt you. That love I don't buy... No because you said that sex without love is masturbation which is not... Masturbation with a real partner. But you know we fought for sexual freedom and now you say the freedom that we we gained is actually masturbating with foreigners or other people. No I just believe I don't want in a fake Christian way to oppose love and sex. What I'm saying and it's nothing bad in it is that loveless sex can be very intense, wonderful. But it's like that scene from documentary about hardcore porn. It's really in what sense masturbating with a real partner. You need some flesh onto which you can project and enact your sexual fantasies. But I think that love enters, it's a very traditional almost romantic notion, but I believe in it. Love enters when you nonetheless open yourself to what I metaphysically call the abyss of the other. That the other is not just a flat screen, this is typical male chauvinist stance you know. And you know where you can see clearly this from romantic literature to Alfred Hitchcock's Vertigo. Where you can clearly see how James Stewart in Vertigo he just needs the new girl Judy to project onto her her image. So the only true love person in the movie is Judy, the real Madeleine, who really loves him and is even ready to sacrifice her identity to become Madeleine, dress up. What I'm saying is again that love for me is not incorporation, I want to possess you. No, love is the beauty of intimate connection where the partner nonetheless retains his her its radical otherness. It's an abyss. And I go here to the end. It's not simply an abyss in the sense that I don't see what you really are. What if you also don't see what you really are? We kind of communicate at this level. That's why, as you must know I repeat this joke in all of my books, I like do they have it auf Deutsch this expression? There is in English in French "tomber" this, you fall in love. Fall literally. Love is not calculation where I look at you I like your hair, your eyes, but not your fingers I don't know, then another and then I make a list "oh this one has five points, let's choose her." No love is... But in German it's sich verlieben, it's reflexive. Ah it's nice, but it's not you don't have this moment of fall which is contingency. There are wonderful psychological studies about this. You never fall in love now. All of a sudden you are aware that you are already in love. And this is the true freedom, I claim. True radical freedom is not to make a choice. It's not you go to a patisserie and say strawberry cake or like yours or or cheesecake or what. It's all of a sudden you experience "this is my fate." But so true radical freedom for you is the moment where you don't have the choice in love? Yeah because the true choice I ground here in my other books even in philosophy Schelling and so on. True choice is unconscious. You experience it as your fate, but you are still fully responsible for it. It's this paradox, isn't this nice about? So can I now make something tricky? I don't know if it makes any sense. But in the end in your book you you write about the fact that even in politics, we need to be democrats, we need to participate, but in the end, you speak about Corona, we
the antagonisms of freedom. They are at a formal level aware that they have these freedoms, but they are at the same time they don't really believe that they can use this freedom. And that's the problem with freedom today. And that's why I will say now something very flat, we will all agree with it I hope. That's why I think that we should remain leftists. Liberalism is a great thing, I don't underestimate personal freedoms, but you know where the left begins? Not with... No no no, I will stop you here. Okay. Because because I'm being in a pro-seminar, you're too good and I have seen thousands of videos and I know so much about you. You're crazy, you're crazy. No no, I'm watching you with your whole theory, TV series. I'm watching your videos since years. I need to find out because you I've read this book and it's crazy. And but in the end you want us in the book in I love the book. Which one? Mehrlust? The last and it's actually the the only one I was able to really finish. The other ones I all had to stop. What changed that I could was able to read a book from you to the end? I'm getting old and I'm living in this doom of maybe this is the last book. So you're getting more and more... Even I am working like crazy. You know there are already two more books. One on Freiheit. Yeah that's why I know so much about Freiheit, freedom. I wrote a new shorter book, pages for me shorter, on freedom. And then another one I just delivered the manuscript on Christian Atheism. Okay let's go on. No no no I know you wrote a hundred books and I love those books on love and we could also talk about love because now that you talk about sexuality and this scene that I also know. I'm here naive, would you agree? Sorry to interrupt you. That love I don't buy... No because you said that sex without love is masturbation which is not... Masturbation with a real partner. But you know we fought for sexual freedom and now you say the freedom that we we gained is actually masturbating with foreigners or other people. No I just believe I don't want in a fake Christian way to oppose love and sex. What I'm saying and it's nothing bad in it is that loveless sex can be very intense, wonderful. But it's like that scene from documentary about hardcore porn. It's really in what sense masturbating with a real partner. You need some flesh onto which you can project and enact your sexual fantasies. But I think that love enters, it's a very traditional almost romantic notion, but I believe in it. Love enters when you nonetheless open yourself to what I metaphysically call the abyss of the other. That the other is not just a flat screen, this is typical male chauvinist stance you know. And you know where you can see clearly this from romantic literature to Alfred Hitchcock's Vertigo. Where you can clearly see how James Stewart in Vertigo he just needs the new girl Judy to project onto her her image. So the only true love person in the movie is Judy, the real Madeleine, who really loves him and is even ready to sacrifice her identity to become Madeleine, dress up. What I'm saying is again that love for me is not incorporation, I want to possess you. No, love is the beauty of intimate connection where the partner nonetheless retains his her its radical otherness. It's an abyss. And I go here to the end. It's not simply an abyss in the sense that I don't see what you really are. What if you also don't see what you really are? We kind of communicate at this level. That's why, as you must know I repeat this joke in all of my books, I like do they have it auf Deutsch this expression? There is in English in French "tomber" this, you fall in love. Fall literally. Love is not calculation where I look at you I like your hair, your eyes, but not your fingers I don't know, then another and then I make a list "oh this one has five points, let's choose her." No love is... But in German it's sich verlieben, it's reflexive. Ah it's nice, but it's not you don't have this moment of fall which is contingency. There are wonderful psychological studies about this. You never fall in love now. All of a sudden you are aware that you are already in love. And this is the true freedom, I claim. True radical freedom is not to make a choice. It's not you go to a patisserie and say strawberry cake or like yours or or cheesecake or what. It's all of a sudden you experience "this is my fate." But so true radical freedom for you is the moment where you don't have the choice in love? Yeah because the true choice I ground here in my other books even in philosophy Schelling and so on. True choice is unconscious. You experience it as your fate, but you are still fully responsible for it. It's this paradox, isn't this nice about? So can I now make something tricky? I don't know if it makes any sense. But in the end in your book you you write about the fact that even in politics, we need to be democrats, we need to participate, but in the end, you speak about Corona, we
unknown
have to obey to the to science and what politicians
have to obey to the to science and what politicians
Slavoj Žižek
say. So there is also a moment then individual when you say it has to like give up the control. You know just... I just tried to try to get you out of
say. So there is also a moment then individual when you say it has to like give up the control. You know just... I just tried to try to get you out of
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your scheme, but... Yeah but I have this I must say... In love you want to get out of control but in your new book you say in a society also we have to discuss participate and in the end we have to follow the
your scheme, but... Yeah but I have this I must say... In love you want to get out of control but in your new book you say in a society also we have to discuss participate and in the end we have to follow the
Slavoj Žižek
choices that like in Corona that they have been made. So you have to give up the control and do what they say. Which I was surprised to hear. Yeah but the whole problem is who makes this choice and so on. What I'm only saying is that okay
choices that like in Corona that they have been made. So you have to give up the control and do what they say. Which I was surprised to hear. Yeah but the whole problem is who makes this choice and so on. What I'm only saying is that okay
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if it's this sounds non-democratic, how would you then approach ecological crisis? Would you say let's debate it to the end blah blah blah. That this is a way
if it's this sounds non-democratic, how would you then approach ecological crisis? Would you say let's debate it to the end blah blah blah. That this is a way
Slavoj Žižek
to do nothing. Something will have to be done. We will have to be told in very firm way. Don't spend so much oil, do this, do that. The problem of course is that these orders as it were Befehle will have to be rationally grounded and so on and so on. But even with rationally grounded I have a problem. Now I ask you with all my provocative spirit. I ask you do you think that we can really explain to people in detail why this or why that? At a certain level you have to trust some authority.
to do nothing. Something will have to be done. We will have to be told in very firm way. Don't spend so much oil, do this, do that. The problem of course is that these orders as it were Befehle will have to be rationally grounded and so on and so on. But even with rationally grounded I have a problem. Now I ask you with all my provocative spirit. I ask you do you think that we can really explain to people in detail why this or why that? At a certain level you have to trust some authority.
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That's my very provocative idea. I don't believe in, maybe you would be critical about this, I don't
That's my very provocative idea. I don't believe in, maybe you would be critical about this, I don't
Slavoj Žižek
believe in authority, I do believe
believe in authority, I do believe
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even if it's a term that is difficult in leadership. I believe that there should be people who are educated enough and and and have enough time to be aware of what is going on in the global crisis and that they should come up with solutions and ideas what has to be done. I don't believe that it should be the authoritarian
even if it's a term that is difficult in leadership. I believe that there should be people who are educated enough and and and have enough time to be aware of what is going on in the global crisis and that they should come up with solutions and ideas what has to be done. I don't believe that it should be the authoritarian
Slavoj Žižek
way because
way because
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what you see is that people think
what you see is that people think
Slavoj Žižek
when the, like when you said with Peterson, when you talked to Peterson you wanted to show that the left can be better. But the moment the left is as authoritarian as right people, why should people say I need the left? So I think the left should also be able to present ideas of organizing societies that give them choices and intrigue them
when the, like when you said with Peterson, when you talked to Peterson you wanted to show that the left can be better. But the moment the left is as authoritarian as right people, why should people say I need the left? So I think the left should also be able to present ideas of organizing societies that give them choices and intrigue them
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into a behavior that is better for solving the crisis. I don't believe that you can come up like Germany is trying to, we have a
into a behavior that is better for solving the crisis. I don't believe that you can come up like Germany is trying to, we have a
Slavoj Žižek
minister of economy, he is trying to implement a new way of how we should heat. Is this the green guy? The green guy, yeah Habeck. And and and there's
minister of economy, he is trying to implement a new way of how we should heat. Is this the green guy? The green guy, yeah Habeck. And and and there's
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so many people going against him though it's actually
so many people going against him though it's actually
Slavoj Žižek
a low I think it's quite a little
a low I think it's quite a little
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law in the end that has to be done anyway it's been done worldwide. But by becoming so so authoritarian you you raise a lot of the the people who
law in the end that has to be done anyway it's been done worldwide. But by becoming so so authoritarian you you raise a lot of the the people who
Slavoj Žižek
feel oppressed, you know? You get all this contra against the upper class the elites and then you come also the right people come in and get the anger of the people. You get the Trump phenomenon as well. So I don't think you can say you know we are more educated, we know the problem and now we have to like reign authoritarianly because we know it's right. I see your point I know. But you know what is why I like to play with this horrible term authoritarian. Why would you not use leadership or leading people offering them offering them options to act? Different ways out of their habits. Yeah but who will make the final decision? But can't more individuals if... this now you are going for me too much into Chinese direction. I'm Chinese now. No you want authoritarian and I'm Chinese. You know Chinese like to say deliberative democracy, you know. Yes but it interests me who then makes the decision. Sorry can I just explain very briefly where I see the problem. I find this horrible what I will say now. That I'm the reason I'm a pessimist today is that we no longer live in an era where the people where we have ideology and then Marxists come and explain how you talk about equality, I say no, your notion of equality is false, it hides and legitimizes hidden inequality. No, now we live in a strange era where you can tell the truth almost literally. You can tell the truth but the system works so that it doesn't matter. Here I'm still committed to my friend although he is denounced as right winger, Peter Sloterdijk, who proposed you know this classic formula of cynical reason. It's no longer you are doing it but you don't know what you are doing. It's I know what I am doing and nonetheless I'm doing it. My example I repeat them all the time and sorry maybe for listeners they will be interested. For example, if I were to be a terrorist I would bomb Kassel and Venice Biennale. You know there if you read their programs, it's all about against colonialism, capitalism blah blah. But as such totally self-critical, they perfectly
feel oppressed, you know? You get all this contra against the upper class the elites and then you come also the right people come in and get the anger of the people. You get the Trump phenomenon as well. So I don't think you can say you know we are more educated, we know the problem and now we have to like reign authoritarianly because we know it's right. I see your point I know. But you know what is why I like to play with this horrible term authoritarian. Why would you not use leadership or leading people offering them offering them options to act? Different ways out of their habits. Yeah but who will make the final decision? But can't more individuals if... this now you are going for me too much into Chinese direction. I'm Chinese now. No you want authoritarian and I'm Chinese. You know Chinese like to say deliberative democracy, you know. Yes but it interests me who then makes the decision. Sorry can I just explain very briefly where I see the problem. I find this horrible what I will say now. That I'm the reason I'm a pessimist today is that we no longer live in an era where the people where we have ideology and then Marxists come and explain how you talk about equality, I say no, your notion of equality is false, it hides and legitimizes hidden inequality. No, now we live in a strange era where you can tell the truth almost literally. You can tell the truth but the system works so that it doesn't matter. Here I'm still committed to my friend although he is denounced as right winger, Peter Sloterdijk, who proposed you know this classic formula of cynical reason. It's no longer you are doing it but you don't know what you are doing. It's I know what I am doing and nonetheless I'm doing it. My example I repeat them all the time and sorry maybe for listeners they will be interested. For example, if I were to be a terrorist I would bomb Kassel and Venice Biennale. You know there if you read their programs, it's all about against colonialism, capitalism blah blah. But as such totally self-critical, they perfectly
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fit today's market. So how and it's the same
fit today's market. So how and it's the same
Slavoj Žižek
with ah disgusting, you remember two years ago or when in Glasgow conference against global warming, they said all the right things, nothing changed. So we live in a strange time where words ideological explanations no longer have efficiency. Why do I know this? Why do you think this? Yeah because no because I identify with it critically. I consider myself ein idealer Zwangsneurotiker. Yeah I love that and we are we are hyperactive
with ah disgusting, you remember two years ago or when in Glasgow conference against global warming, they said all the right things, nothing changed. So we live in a strange time where words ideological explanations no longer have efficiency. Why do I know this? Why do you think this? Yeah because no because I identify with it critically. I consider myself ein idealer Zwangsneurotiker. Yeah I love that and we are we are hyperactive
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not to achieve something but to make it sure that
not to achieve something but to make it sure that
Slavoj Žižek
nothing will change, you know. I agree with you and I call this pop-culturalization of political thinking. Yeah. Because actually all the cultural players have been made political agents in some way. They are
nothing will change, you know. I agree with you and I call this pop-culturalization of political thinking. Yeah. Because actually all the cultural players have been made political agents in some way. They are
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not making art, they're making political representation of art and this way they are being instrumentalized. And I perfectly know what you mean when you say you could like throw bombs on all these institutions because there's
not making art, they're making political representation of art and this way they are being instrumentalized. And I perfectly know what you mean when you say you could like throw bombs on all these institutions because there's
Slavoj Žižek
nothing subversive, there's
nothing subversive, there's
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nothing authentic, there's nothing from a deep-down realm that comes there but they fit in they're just another representation of the agenda of
nothing authentic, there's nothing from a deep-down realm that comes there but they fit in they're just another representation of the agenda of
Slavoj Žižek
the establishment as well
the establishment as well
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establishment society. But I don't simplify things here like let's return to Deutsche Kultur. You know who whom I like? They're I'm not saying in this flat they're all equal. Another shock for you but maybe not for you. I have no shock so far. No no you you maybe you
establishment society. But I don't simplify things here like let's return to Deutsche Kultur. You know who whom I like? They're I'm not saying in this flat they're all equal. Another shock for you but maybe not for you. I have no shock so far. No no you you maybe you
Slavoj Žižek
know it. For example I like Rammstein, I admit it. That is a shock for me. Really? You don't like them? I think they're radical left really. And the way they undermine fascism from... But you know you know what's going on with them at the moment. No I don't know this. Yeah you don't know this because that's difficult because in Germany now even in Europe there's many women who came out with the way that Rammstein is organizing the backstage realm by like picking women from outside organizing that they will see them the singer, the lead singer, and that he can have sex in whatever ways or other things. Ah no, I'm here very conservative. I don't agree with, especially now some provocative things for our listeners. But but you know the time where you can like provoke with Rammstein has become more complicated now. I know, no no, it's not so much a provocation. I
know it. For example I like Rammstein, I admit it. That is a shock for me. Really? You don't like them? I think they're radical left really. And the way they undermine fascism from... But you know you know what's going on with them at the moment. No I don't know this. Yeah you don't know this because that's difficult because in Germany now even in Europe there's many women who came out with the way that Rammstein is organizing the backstage realm by like picking women from outside organizing that they will see them the singer, the lead singer, and that he can have sex in whatever ways or other things. Ah no, I'm here very conservative. I don't agree with, especially now some provocative things for our listeners. But but you know the time where you can like provoke with Rammstein has become more complicated now. I know, no no, it's not so much a provocation. I
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think that what they are doing is that they undermine authoritarian in bad sense this proto-fascist spirit from within. They enact it openly and in this sense they they make it seen in how ridiculous it is. No wonder I was told that... Yeah but they also play with the Eros of Nazism, you know? When they show Leni Riefenstahl and when they have this aesthetic, we also have people that you are very aware of the subconscious, you know, it triggers subconscious things in people. And I do think it's not just left what they do. They are playing with fascist things not in an only left way, but they accept the subconscious trigger. That's why people on the right also like their music and their shows I think. Yeah but nonetheless politically I don't think any right wingers are different. I I followed at some point what real right wingers what music they listen. You know it's more nice romantic songs and so on. It's not so simple but okay. But they wouldn't listen to Dalmatinske pjesme I guess. I am I have I have problems here. You know who is my ideal composer? You will have never guessed.
think that what they are doing is that they undermine authoritarian in bad sense this proto-fascist spirit from within. They enact it openly and in this sense they they make it seen in how ridiculous it is. No wonder I was told that... Yeah but they also play with the Eros of Nazism, you know? When they show Leni Riefenstahl and when they have this aesthetic, we also have people that you are very aware of the subconscious, you know, it triggers subconscious things in people. And I do think it's not just left what they do. They are playing with fascist things not in an only left way, but they accept the subconscious trigger. That's why people on the right also like their music and their shows I think. Yeah but nonetheless politically I don't think any right wingers are different. I I followed at some point what real right wingers what music they listen. You know it's more nice romantic songs and so on. It's not so simple but okay. But they wouldn't listen to Dalmatinske pjesme I guess. I am I have I have problems here. You know who is my ideal composer? You will have never guessed.
Slavoj Žižek
The true pupil of Schönberg, not Berg, Webern, Hanns Eisler. He was the impossible ideal of pupil of
The true pupil of Schönberg, not Berg, Webern, Hanns Eisler. He was the impossible ideal of pupil of
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Schönberg. His ideal was to do a workers song in 12-tone in 12-tone. And he is really good in the sense of not only the DDR Auferstanden aus Ruinen national anthem, but you know it's so beautiful. You can find it immediately totally legally on YouTube. He made music minutes to Joris Ivens
Schönberg. His ideal was to do a workers song in 12-tone in 12-tone. And he is really good in the sense of not only the DDR Auferstanden aus Ruinen national anthem, but you know it's so beautiful. You can find it immediately totally legally on YouTube. He made music minutes to Joris Ivens
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documentary from '32, '3, "Rain in Amsterdam". It's totally abstract. Joris Ivens is almost, he was also a Maoist, but wonderful documentary because he tried to make movies about things which you cannot see. He made a wonderful documentary on wind, on Wind, you know. These are for me the true leftists. I have very strange tastes here. No no it's, I'm
documentary from '32, '3, "Rain in Amsterdam". It's totally abstract. Joris Ivens is almost, he was also a Maoist, but wonderful documentary because he tried to make movies about things which you cannot see. He made a wonderful documentary on wind, on Wind, you know. These are for me the true leftists. I have very strange tastes here. No no it's, I'm
Slavoj Žižek
trying the more we talk I'm trying to talk to you in the way I see you in your books in
trying the more we talk I'm trying to talk to you in the way I see you in your books in
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this I don't want to have structure. I love that you because I think it's interesting everybody...
this I don't want to have structure. I love that you because I think it's interesting everybody...
Slavoj Žižek
Yeah but I'm trying and then my evil
Yeah but I'm trying and then my evil
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nature overcomes
nature overcomes
Slavoj Žižek
it. I know but I'm and I'm trying to overcome this need of structure
it. I know but I'm and I'm trying to overcome this need of structure
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and the need of professional
and the need of professional
Slavoj Žižek
presentation of all you know because I've been I saw all of that so much so I'm trying to get... You're crazy. I
presentation of all you know because I've been I saw all of that so much so I'm trying to get... You're crazy. I
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cannot see I with all my nervous tics and so
cannot see I with all my nervous tics and so
Slavoj Žižek
on, I cannot for more than one minute I cannot watch myself on a screen. I become disgusted by myself. That's why now I feel better because it's only the voice. But it's always different when you watch yourself. I never watch my screen. Yeah me also, yes that's horrible. But let me get back to you because I mean everybody should read your book, the new one, I think because it's the first book I managed to really really finish. And but I want to go back to Slavoj Žižek when you were in Yugoslavia. Because the first video that made me, yeah that made me really I don't want to say fan, fangirling is horrible, but I loved it, is when you stand on a bridge in Ljubljana and you talk about the West and the and the Balkans and you're on this bridge and I even made a video on Instagram about this... I know when I say "what are there, here..." Yeah it's it's so great. You're you're standing on the bridge and then you say it's almost as famous as the bridge in Paris. And then you say here is the West and women get beaten and they don't like it and here is the Balkans women get beaten and they like it. Yeah yeah yeah. No no no no no. I had a big problem with this. I but I wonder if you agree with me here. That's why, and he really hates me, Emir Kusturica. That's why I have problems with him. I think that in his most famous film what was it, "Underground"? It's not that he is Balkan, he stages Balkan mythology for the West. I agree with you. This is not authentic Balkan or whatever. And that's why his big trauma. He wanted to succeed in the West. When he didn't, he blames although we hate each other, I mean me and Bernard-Henri Lévy. He has this idea that the two of us are most guilty for ruining his Hollywood
on, I cannot for more than one minute I cannot watch myself on a screen. I become disgusted by myself. That's why now I feel better because it's only the voice. But it's always different when you watch yourself. I never watch my screen. Yeah me also, yes that's horrible. But let me get back to you because I mean everybody should read your book, the new one, I think because it's the first book I managed to really really finish. And but I want to go back to Slavoj Žižek when you were in Yugoslavia. Because the first video that made me, yeah that made me really I don't want to say fan, fangirling is horrible, but I loved it, is when you stand on a bridge in Ljubljana and you talk about the West and the and the Balkans and you're on this bridge and I even made a video on Instagram about this... I know when I say "what are there, here..." Yeah it's it's so great. You're you're standing on the bridge and then you say it's almost as famous as the bridge in Paris. And then you say here is the West and women get beaten and they don't like it and here is the Balkans women get beaten and they like it. Yeah yeah yeah. No no no no no. I had a big problem with this. I but I wonder if you agree with me here. That's why, and he really hates me, Emir Kusturica. That's why I have problems with him. I think that in his most famous film what was it, "Underground"? It's not that he is Balkan, he stages Balkan mythology for the West. I agree with you. This is not authentic Balkan or whatever. And that's why his big trauma. He wanted to succeed in the West. When he didn't, he blames although we hate each other, I mean me and Bernard-Henri Lévy. He has this idea that the two of us are most guilty for ruining his Hollywood
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career and so on and so on. And I especially don't like Kusturica because you know he got from Dodik a whole small town. Like I hate people who are again, what we were talking for, fully integrated into power but still play to be marginal dissidents and so on, you know. I know. I hate that too. Yeah. Yeah. So that's my problem. I'm not saying he is a bad cinematographer. I think he began well with that Oca na službenom putu and his early movies. I was just thinking about yourself. I mean you are also now back
career and so on and so on. And I especially don't like Kusturica because you know he got from Dodik a whole small town. Like I hate people who are again, what we were talking for, fully integrated into power but still play to be marginal dissidents and so on, you know. I know. I hate that too. Yeah. Yeah. So that's my problem. I'm not saying he is a bad cinematographer. I think he began well with that Oca na službenom putu and his early movies. I was just thinking about yourself. I mean you are also now back
Slavoj Žižek
from this this the travel you've made from this man on the bridge the young Slovenian philosopher to now the
from this this the travel you've made from this man on the bridge the young Slovenian philosopher to now the
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most dangerous philosopher of the world. Or
most dangerous philosopher of the world. Or
Slavoj Žižek
definitely the most famous
definitely the most famous
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and a person
and a person
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I mean
I mean
Slavoj Žižek
you make people study Lacan. So how do you
you make people study Lacan. So how do you
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how have you integrated your own journey into you know? I don't think about it. I I I I hate not in as an empty phrase. I never ask questions what's with me. I have this naive conviction that I don't want to look deep into myself. But you've been to therapy or to analysis? Ah, I did it in my way. You talked you talked. I was in deep crisis personal
how have you integrated your own journey into you know? I don't think about it. I I I I hate not in as an empty phrase. I never ask questions what's with me. I have this naive conviction that I don't want to look deep into myself. But you've been to therapy or to analysis? Ah, I did it in my way. You talked you talked. I was in deep crisis personal
Slavoj Žižek
on the edge of suicide unfortunate love affair blah blah the usual romantic story. And I was going to analyst for a
on the edge of suicide unfortunate love affair blah blah the usual romantic story. And I was going to analyst for a
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couple of months and as you can imagine, I talked all the time. Yeah. Because I was afraid
couple of months and as you can imagine, I talked all the time. Yeah. Because I was afraid
Slavoj Žižek
that if I stop talking for a second, the analyst will ask me some really difficult question. Then when I when I came out of this suicidal crisis, I stopped it because I'm although I'm following Freud blah blah, but something I found something so repulsive in this idea let's look deep into yourself or myself. If you look deep into any
that if I stop talking for a second, the analyst will ask me some really difficult question. Then when I when I came out of this suicidal crisis, I stopped it because I'm although I'm following Freud blah blah, but something I found something so repulsive in this idea let's look deep into yourself or myself. If you look deep into any
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person you will discover shit. Dirty dreams, horrible things and so on. I don't... But aren't they interesting, why is that interesting? No. No. Maybe for idiots and so on. I like appearances, masks. I I think the only way to do something great is to have an obviously false wrong idea about yourself and to follow it to the end. And what about the whole trend nowadays to look into yourself, self-awareness, therapy, inner journey? Oh my god, here I where is Comrade Stalin to introduce terror to erase this.
person you will discover shit. Dirty dreams, horrible things and so on. I don't... But aren't they interesting, why is that interesting? No. No. Maybe for idiots and so on. I like appearances, masks. I I think the only way to do something great is to have an obviously false wrong idea about yourself and to follow it to the end. And what about the whole trend nowadays to look into yourself, self-awareness, therapy, inner journey? Oh my god, here I where is Comrade Stalin to introduce terror to erase this.
Slavoj Žižek
You know even in Hollywood this goes with me. I hate this Actor Studio Marlon Brando from fifties on. My ideal actor is Cary Grant. Totally cold, just acting, no identification and so on, you know. I I have a story for you on this one. I think it was Al Pacino or or Robert De Niro, they do
You know even in Hollywood this goes with me. I hate this Actor Studio Marlon Brando from fifties on. My ideal actor is Cary Grant. Totally cold, just acting, no identification and so on, you know. I I have a story for you on this one. I think it was Al Pacino or or Robert De Niro, they do
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this method method acting yeah. And they came to to the
this method method acting yeah. And they came to to the
Slavoj Žižek
recordings to the studio and they had to play a character that's really worn out and tired and so he came, woke up early, ran there and got there exhausted and then they say "but why do you do this?" "Yeah, because my character is like this and that." And the other person said "so what if you try acting?" Yeah yeah yeah. Hitchcock often said this when again with this new actress "don't try to be just act it" and so on. But you know why? There is a deeper philosophical foundation haha here. I think that already in real life, we are not who we are, we are acting. Acting in the sense that we identify with a certain image of ourselves. But do you think that nowadays many people think that they are being inauthentic when they are acting? Because we have this trend of "oh I have to be authentic." No no, I'm totally against against authenticity because authenticity
recordings to the studio and they had to play a character that's really worn out and tired and so he came, woke up early, ran there and got there exhausted and then they say "but why do you do this?" "Yeah, because my character is like this and that." And the other person said "so what if you try acting?" Yeah yeah yeah. Hitchcock often said this when again with this new actress "don't try to be just act it" and so on. But you know why? There is a deeper philosophical foundation haha here. I think that already in real life, we are not who we are, we are acting. Acting in the sense that we identify with a certain image of ourselves. But do you think that nowadays many people think that they are being inauthentic when they are acting? Because we have this trend of "oh I have to be authentic." No no, I'm totally against against authenticity because authenticity
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presupposes that behind all the games you are playing, you have some deep identity, the real yourself. Maybe there is something
presupposes that behind all the games you are playing, you have some deep identity, the real yourself. Maybe there is something
Slavoj Žižek
like this, but I
like this, but I
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prefer not to know about it. It's horrible, it's nightmare. And this is, you know, the lesson of psychoanalysis. It's not become who you truly are. The lesson of psychoanalysis
prefer not to know about it. It's horrible, it's nightmare. And this is, you know, the lesson of psychoanalysis. It's not become who you truly are. The lesson of psychoanalysis
Slavoj Žižek
is just to confront briefly that horror so that then you again acquire a distance from it. I don't believe again in this be open, say everything. I believe in politeness. I think the nicest thing about civilization
is just to confront briefly that horror so that then you again acquire a distance from it. I don't believe again in this be open, say everything. I believe in politeness. I think the nicest thing about civilization
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is this what I call sincere hypocrisy. Let's say we meet
is this what I call sincere hypocrisy. Let's say we meet
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on the street, it's a bad example, it's not true, but let's say I really hate you and I see you on the street and although in in my mind my idea is "my god why didn't I notice you a minute earlier so that I could avoid you?" But when I see you, I have to say "how nice to meet you, how are you today?" In a way, we both know that it's not sincere, but it
on the street, it's a bad example, it's not true, but let's say I really hate you and I see you on the street and although in in my mind my idea is "my god why didn't I notice you a minute earlier so that I could avoid you?" But when I see you, I have to say "how nice to meet you, how are you today?" In a way, we both know that it's not sincere, but it
Slavoj Žižek
nonetheless works as some kind
nonetheless works as some kind
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of elementary kindness. You know, the signal is not 'I really mean this,' the signal is this superficial kindness. I believe in this. I agree with you because in Croatia we have
of elementary kindness. You know, the signal is not 'I really mean this,' the signal is this superficial kindness. I believe in this. I agree with you because in Croatia we have
Slavoj Žižek
this tradition a lot in the street, you know you you're very kind you turn around and you talk very bad about people all the time people have but the kindness with each other is nice. But I always debate is it good or bad and I figured out in my generation since we have the cell phone we often look into our phones and pretend we don't see each other. You know you don't think oh if I had seen her one minute before I could avoid. Now you can look in the phone and like I know I was so busy talking or doing something and I often wonder what would be would be... But I no no I'm more brutal here. I don't even look into the phone. You know so often it happens to me I walk with a friend on a street and I noticed nothing. And then friend told me "didn't you see we just passed your worst enemy there?" No I think my perception is already censored that what I consciously see it excludes people that I don't
this tradition a lot in the street, you know you you're very kind you turn around and you talk very bad about people all the time people have but the kindness with each other is nice. But I always debate is it good or bad and I figured out in my generation since we have the cell phone we often look into our phones and pretend we don't see each other. You know you don't think oh if I had seen her one minute before I could avoid. Now you can look in the phone and like I know I was so busy talking or doing something and I often wonder what would be would be... But I no no I'm more brutal here. I don't even look into the phone. You know so often it happens to me I walk with a friend on a street and I noticed nothing. And then friend told me "didn't you see we just passed your worst enemy there?" No I think my perception is already censored that what I consciously see it excludes people that I don't
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want to to meet. That's
want to to meet. That's
Slavoj Žižek
why also I'm up to up to immigrants and so on. I'm totally opposed to this liberal stupidity "we should know better each other." No. How why should I know you better
why also I'm up to up to immigrants and so on. I'm totally opposed to this liberal stupidity "we should know better each other." No. How why should I know you better
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when I don't even know myself? My ideal society is one of respect, tolerance, among different groups and then sometimes miracles happen, you get really attached to somebody, but not under this pressure. Not this forced "oh we don't understand their culture." Why should I and why should they? I am for distance. And work and work.
when I don't even know myself? My ideal society is one of respect, tolerance, among different groups and then sometimes miracles happen, you get really attached to somebody, but not under this pressure. Not this forced "oh we don't understand their culture." Why should I and why should they? I am for distance. And work and work.
Slavoj Žižek
I think you... Absolutely. When when somebody ask me, he didn't dare to use it, a journalist years ago "which is your favorite proverb motto?" I said that you can imagine what.
I think you... Absolutely. When when somebody ask me, he didn't dare to use it, a journalist years ago "which is your favorite proverb motto?" I said that you can imagine what.
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I said "Arbeit macht frei." I said I know it was in
I said "Arbeit macht frei." I said I know it was in
Slavoj Žižek
Auschwitz, but it was
Auschwitz, but it was
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it's a true thought which was simply brutally misused by Nazis. It was a
it's a true thought which was simply brutally misused by Nazis. It was a
Slavoj Žižek
brutal irony, you know. But in reality this works for me. I hate this contemplative attitude of just no forget about yourself, get engaged. Or how did that TV series, I forgot the title, about aliens? "The truth is out there." Yeah but again the new left or the new left is talking and we have to talk, that's so complex because you have the working class that works in factories and has hard jobs and I don't think that for them it's it's good to work all the time, so they need protection from from from this kind of work. But
brutal irony, you know. But in reality this works for me. I hate this contemplative attitude of just no forget about yourself, get engaged. Or how did that TV series, I forgot the title, about aliens? "The truth is out there." Yeah but again the new left or the new left is talking and we have to talk, that's so complex because you have the working class that works in factories and has hard jobs and I don't think that for them it's it's good to work all the time, so they need protection from from from this kind of work. But
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on the other hand it's interesting that a lot of the left
on the other hand it's interesting that a lot of the left
Slavoj Žižek
elite now is talking about about how they have to take care of themselves, how they should not work so much, like this work ethos. And we have a young generation that says we in Germany at least have a huge
elite now is talking about about how they have to take care of themselves, how they should not work so much, like this work ethos. And we have a young generation that says we in Germany at least have a huge
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debate that young people are trying to get more work-life balance
debate that young people are trying to get more work-life balance
Slavoj Žižek
they say, but the thing is that they don't like to give too much time of their life to the work and want more time for friends and life. This is here is my difference. I don't believe in this balance. I like creative catastrophes obsession. That's how I interpret love. Always I quote that Neil Gaiman. Let's say you
they say, but the thing is that they don't like to give too much time of their life to the work and want more time for friends and life. This is here is my difference. I don't believe in this balance. I like creative catastrophes obsession. That's how I interpret love. Always I quote that Neil Gaiman. Let's say you
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live a happy life. You meet in the evening with friends, balanced, a little bit of sex, one night stand here there blah blah. Then you fall passionately in love. Your life is ruined. You cannot find balance, but I like this. Radical imbalance. I believe in this. Or with work, fanatic work, you have a big goal. I believe in the I don't believe in organic harmonious life. I believe in this extreme unsettling engagement. All of a sudden I discover this love, political engagement,
live a happy life. You meet in the evening with friends, balanced, a little bit of sex, one night stand here there blah blah. Then you fall passionately in love. Your life is ruined. You cannot find balance, but I like this. Radical imbalance. I believe in this. Or with work, fanatic work, you have a big goal. I believe in the I don't believe in organic harmonious life. I believe in this extreme unsettling engagement. All of a sudden I discover this love, political engagement,
Slavoj Žižek
work, and this matters more than everything for me. That's why again I in a very friendly debate with that I think Korean guy who now works here... Ah, Byung-Chul Han. "Die Müdigkeit", yeah. Yeah when he speaks about exhaustion and I think I developed pretty well how we are all over-worked today at three levels, but it's not just physical work. One is of
work, and this matters more than everything for me. That's why again I in a very friendly debate with that I think Korean guy who now works here... Ah, Byung-Chul Han. "Die Müdigkeit", yeah. Yeah when he speaks about exhaustion and I think I developed pretty well how we are all over-worked today at three levels, but it's not just physical work. One is of
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course ordinary people or those who work physically they are simply tired. But for me, would you agree?
course ordinary people or those who work physically they are simply tired. But for me, would you agree?
Slavoj Žižek
It's almost worse the tiredness of when your job is to take care of other people. There's an old lady sitting senile, she is not guilty of it, but you know how tiresome is to play that it's not just mechanical work, you have to be kind towards her. And then almost worst for me is this lower manager level where you have to instrumentalize your creativity itself. You you have to be inventive and so on, but what? How to better sell a product about which you don't care? So in this sense, yes, we are ultra exhausted today. But I would say in a very naive sense that it's simply not a creative exhaustion. There is nothing better I feel so well when I succeed in writing a good couple of pages and I'm dead tired, but at that point I'm happy because I'm a workaholic. I don't feel well if every day pure boy scout I don't do something towards the evening and so on, you know. It's horrible. I'm a workaholic and I I am never happy. Slavoj I just wanted to have another
It's almost worse the tiredness of when your job is to take care of other people. There's an old lady sitting senile, she is not guilty of it, but you know how tiresome is to play that it's not just mechanical work, you have to be kind towards her. And then almost worst for me is this lower manager level where you have to instrumentalize your creativity itself. You you have to be inventive and so on, but what? How to better sell a product about which you don't care? So in this sense, yes, we are ultra exhausted today. But I would say in a very naive sense that it's simply not a creative exhaustion. There is nothing better I feel so well when I succeed in writing a good couple of pages and I'm dead tired, but at that point I'm happy because I'm a workaholic. I don't feel well if every day pure boy scout I don't do something towards the evening and so on, you know. It's horrible. I'm a workaholic and I I am never happy. Slavoj I just wanted to have another
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thing. Okay. Because I know very little and I don't know maybe you don't want that but I know very little about you said Kusturica is not the Balkans or selling the Balkans as as the West wanted it. Yeah. But what for you what was for you the Balkans and how how did you grow up? How did you grow up? I didn't care about it. That was the good thing. How not if you care, but how was it? Where was it? If you Okay I will give you a couple of very simple coordinates which are responsible for creating conditions that I am
thing. Okay. Because I know very little and I don't know maybe you don't want that but I know very little about you said Kusturica is not the Balkans or selling the Balkans as as the West wanted it. Yeah. But what for you what was for you the Balkans and how how did you grow up? How did you grow up? I didn't care about it. That was the good thing. How not if you care, but how was it? Where was it? If you Okay I will give you a couple of very simple coordinates which are responsible for creating conditions that I am
Slavoj Žižek
able to be what I am now. The one is that when things in Yugoslavia went down and there was no longer one obligatory party theory, there was nice pluralism. In Belgrade there was more analytic philosophy, in Zagreb praxis Marxism, in Slovenia Heideggerians and so on. So it was an open space. Then borders were open, we could go out. And then for popular culture, the defining event of my youth is that when I was they opened a kinoteka, cinematek in Ljubljana. For two, three years I was every afternoon there, I saw all the classic. And our generally privilege was that when communism fell down, we didn't have any of these East European illusions. We already had pornography, we had
able to be what I am now. The one is that when things in Yugoslavia went down and there was no longer one obligatory party theory, there was nice pluralism. In Belgrade there was more analytic philosophy, in Zagreb praxis Marxism, in Slovenia Heideggerians and so on. So it was an open space. Then borders were open, we could go out. And then for popular culture, the defining event of my youth is that when I was they opened a kinoteka, cinematek in Ljubljana. For two, three years I was every afternoon there, I saw all the classic. And our generally privilege was that when communism fell down, we didn't have any of these East European illusions. We already had pornography, we had
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borders were more
borders were more
Slavoj Žižek
or less completely open. So we in ex-Yugoslavia at least the way I experience Slovenia, we were without illusions about the East. We are not like those Western idiots who claim "but you Yugoslavia you were something special authentic socialism." No. But at the same time we didn't have illusions about the West. This was a very creative moment. I think I was very lucky. And you have this energy from this time you think? I mean you're No it must be something it's horrible. No no, it was I was always nervous. That's why, you know, I'm the only guy that I know even from younger generation, I never tasted
or less completely open. So we in ex-Yugoslavia at least the way I experience Slovenia, we were without illusions about the East. We are not like those Western idiots who claim "but you Yugoslavia you were something special authentic socialism." No. But at the same time we didn't have illusions about the West. This was a very creative moment. I think I was very lucky. And you have this energy from this time you think? I mean you're No it must be something it's horrible. No no, it was I was always nervous. That's why, you know, I'm the only guy that I know even from younger generation, I never tasted
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any drug, not even marijuana. Never in my life was I drunk. You know why? Because of my Stalinist stance. My idea is you get drunk, then you start to seeing friendly to people and then enemy attacks and you are not ready. I always live in this
any drug, not even marijuana. Never in my life was I drunk. You know why? Because of my Stalinist stance. My idea is you get drunk, then you start to seeing friendly to people and then enemy attacks and you are not ready. I always live in this
Slavoj Žižek
paranoia, you know.
paranoia, you know.
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I understand. I understand. But I think that's also something quite Balkan. But they... But they get very drunk. They get very drunk. I accept, I don't have any fears about. No for me this is not this is not we just should distinguish between I will use this horrible term "real Balkan" and the Western myth of the Balkan. There is a long tradition of imagining Balkan and then Balkan people identifying with but this is not a specialty of Balkan. When I was in Argentina, they
I understand. I understand. But I think that's also something quite Balkan. But they... But they get very drunk. They get very drunk. I accept, I don't have any fears about. No for me this is not this is not we just should distinguish between I will use this horrible term "real Balkan" and the Western myth of the Balkan. There is a long tradition of imagining Balkan and then Balkan people identifying with but this is not a specialty of Balkan. When I was in Argentina, they
Slavoj Žižek
told me you know this Argentinian identity Gauchos? This was invented by British travelers there. And then when they split or when from Spain, Argentina, they were reading these books and by identifying with foreign gaze on them they... no I am here authentically multiculturalist. Not this we are all brothers but my our identities are radically mixed all of them. Your new book has the subtitle "For the Unverwirrten", "für die Unverwirrten". Yeah yeah, no this is of course ironic reference to Maimonides I think who wrote "A Guide for the Perplexed". My idea is exactly the opposite one. We need today to be more perplexed. And I love that and that's why I want this podcast to perplex people and I want you to not have order and I want us to be perplexing and and I want to be confusing because there's so many thoughts that you bring in into my mind that are giving disorder but still calm. You have a confusing thing... This is a very nice point that you make. People are often telling me "but don't you get a headache just confusion?" No, I try to do precisely what you said, that just let yourself to this confusion and it will have a calming effect. Right and you make that. And I will tell you this, it's the first time in my life this morning I used my... you said you want disorder. I've been spending the whole week with your videos, your books. You're crazy. You're crazy. But okay. But listen. This morning in the hotel, I took my face cream tube and put it on my on my toothbrush. So if you want this what's what is it this Verwirrung? Perplexed, perplexity. Yeah, you got that in me definitely, but still I feel calmer. But I'm just not so able to... But I could tell you stories at this level what happens to me. But that's
told me you know this Argentinian identity Gauchos? This was invented by British travelers there. And then when they split or when from Spain, Argentina, they were reading these books and by identifying with foreign gaze on them they... no I am here authentically multiculturalist. Not this we are all brothers but my our identities are radically mixed all of them. Your new book has the subtitle "For the Unverwirrten", "für die Unverwirrten". Yeah yeah, no this is of course ironic reference to Maimonides I think who wrote "A Guide for the Perplexed". My idea is exactly the opposite one. We need today to be more perplexed. And I love that and that's why I want this podcast to perplex people and I want you to not have order and I want us to be perplexing and and I want to be confusing because there's so many thoughts that you bring in into my mind that are giving disorder but still calm. You have a confusing thing... This is a very nice point that you make. People are often telling me "but don't you get a headache just confusion?" No, I try to do precisely what you said, that just let yourself to this confusion and it will have a calming effect. Right and you make that. And I will tell you this, it's the first time in my life this morning I used my... you said you want disorder. I've been spending the whole week with your videos, your books. You're crazy. You're crazy. But okay. But listen. This morning in the hotel, I took my face cream tube and put it on my on my toothbrush. So if you want this what's what is it this Verwirrung? Perplexed, perplexity. Yeah, you got that in me definitely, but still I feel calmer. But I'm just not so able to... But I could tell you stories at this level what happens to me. But that's
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what I wanted to know, how is your everyday life if that is your world? It happens to me regularly that I took off my dirty socks or underwear and then I put them into the toilet and flush it and so on. I have absolute confusion. But I get used to it and it works. I could imagine
what I wanted to know, how is your everyday life if that is your world? It happens to me regularly that I took off my dirty socks or underwear and then I put them into the toilet and flush it and so on. I have absolute confusion. But I get used to it and it works. I could imagine
Slavoj Žižek
after these
after these
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days. On the other hand
days. On the other hand
Slavoj Žižek
I'm an obsessional planner, you know. I know that, yeah. And I know then people tell me "but why do you make plans when you know that they never work?" They are idiots. This is Mehrlust for me. I tell them "but that's the highest pleasure. Oh my god, now we have to change the plan a little bit." That's the true planner. And you know when it's too much? That's something I wouldn't know because we once talked if we can meet somewhere fast and you were "ah no to bi bilo traumatično, to nećemo", so you actually know when to stop something. No this is much simpler, you know. I have some medical, I have strong diabetes, always afraid that they will have to cut off fingers on my legs. I will have to make it slower. I have one very serious thing that I want to bring to the end. I still think it's important that we have some voices like yours to criticize capitalism in this radical way that you do. And there's so much to find about about your thinking and I know we couldn't do this in minutes, but for me personally, today is a special day that I can't say or don't want to talk about, but I wanted to the working class and the worker, which is also something that has disappeared from the discourse, you know in a way when people... But I think it's pluralized
I'm an obsessional planner, you know. I know that, yeah. And I know then people tell me "but why do you make plans when you know that they never work?" They are idiots. This is Mehrlust for me. I tell them "but that's the highest pleasure. Oh my god, now we have to change the plan a little bit." That's the true planner. And you know when it's too much? That's something I wouldn't know because we once talked if we can meet somewhere fast and you were "ah no to bi bilo traumatično, to nećemo", so you actually know when to stop something. No this is much simpler, you know. I have some medical, I have strong diabetes, always afraid that they will have to cut off fingers on my legs. I will have to make it slower. I have one very serious thing that I want to bring to the end. I still think it's important that we have some voices like yours to criticize capitalism in this radical way that you do. And there's so much to find about about your thinking and I know we couldn't do this in minutes, but for me personally, today is a special day that I can't say or don't want to talk about, but I wanted to the working class and the worker, which is also something that has disappeared from the discourse, you know in a way when people... But I think it's pluralized
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today. The first thing to notice
today. The first thing to notice
Slavoj Žižek
is that the counterpoint to this techno-feudalism are precarious workers. This is the most ingenious capitalist invention because you don't even perceive yourself as a worker, but as a small capitalist, you own your car or whatever. I mean I think that there is more exploitation than ever today, it's just already in its form
is that the counterpoint to this techno-feudalism are precarious workers. This is the most ingenious capitalist invention because you don't even perceive yourself as a worker, but as a small capitalist, you own your car or whatever. I mean I think that there is more exploitation than ever today, it's just already in its form
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concealed. And that's what I wanted to talk to you just the last topic we're gonna
concealed. And that's what I wanted to talk to you just the last topic we're gonna
Slavoj Žižek
touch and then we're going to finish this. But the worker. You know we've seen in France like the these whole whole protest against Macron that made him not go to Davos because he realized it's getting serious. And just a little maybe a tribute to the worker because in one video that I saw you said that the working class, the classism is nothing you support as... Ah no, I meant something else. There is a strategy which is almost a proto-fascist strategy of that workers should be admitted and their way of life recognized in their identity. No for me the definition of a true proletarian is not I want my identity but my program is I don't want
touch and then we're going to finish this. But the worker. You know we've seen in France like the these whole whole protest against Macron that made him not go to Davos because he realized it's getting serious. And just a little maybe a tribute to the worker because in one video that I saw you said that the working class, the classism is nothing you support as... Ah no, I meant something else. There is a strategy which is almost a proto-fascist strategy of that workers should be admitted and their way of life recognized in their identity. No for me the definition of a true proletarian is not I want my identity but my program is I don't want
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to be what I am. This negativity,
to be what I am. This negativity,
Slavoj Žižek
while classism is for me identity politics transferred to class. The idea is we rich people, more educated, should nonetheless admire ordinary people,
while classism is for me identity politics transferred to class. The idea is we rich people, more educated, should nonetheless admire ordinary people,
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their modest rituals in local cafeteria or what pub. I don't trust this. The true discontent is again, I want to be something else. And that's something that's been in my mind since I heard you because
their modest rituals in local cafeteria or what pub. I don't trust this. The true discontent is again, I want to be something else. And that's something that's been in my mind since I heard you because
Slavoj Žižek
now I understand it fully because my parents are working class obviously and and and these people always pretended like they understood and valued them,
now I understand it fully because my parents are working class obviously and and and these people always pretended like they understood and valued them,
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but for me it was instinctively I thought but all their life was about getting over
but for me it was instinctively I thought but all their life was about getting over
Slavoj Žižek
working class
working class
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life. And they sacrificed everything for getting over a working class life. And when you said say
life. And they sacrificed everything for getting over a working class life. And when you said say
Slavoj Žižek
that classism is in a way denying them
that classism is in a way denying them
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the fact that it's a fight
the fact that it's a fight
Slavoj Žižek
out of a cast that this capitalism has created. It's good that you mention the cast, this was my experience.
out of a cast that this capitalism has created. It's good that you mention the cast, this was my experience.
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Years ago I visited
Years ago I visited
Slavoj Žižek
India in New Delhi, I met representatives of the lowest of the lowest class, those who are cleaning dry toilets. And I asked them "what's your program?" And again they gave me a perfect
India in New Delhi, I met representatives of the lowest of the lowest class, those who are cleaning dry toilets. And I asked them "what's your program?" And again they gave me a perfect
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definition. "We don't want to be what we are." That's the base of our none of this Gandhi style. Every class every cast has its identity,
definition. "We don't want to be what we are." That's the base of our none of this Gandhi style. Every class every cast has its identity,
Slavoj Žižek
is divine in its own way and so on and so on. I learned to be very critical of Gandhi among the leftists in India. Yeah Arundhati Roy speaks about that in our podcast a lot
is divine in its own way and so on and so on. I learned to be very critical of Gandhi among the leftists in India. Yeah Arundhati Roy speaks about that in our podcast a lot
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what's critical about Gandhi. But the last question. We talked about the progressive or the radical left at the moment and identity politics and now we are back in the working class. Who's gonna fight their fight? The angry worker when the young intellectuals are not aware of the society and the political currents that cause that life? There is no single I
what's critical about Gandhi. But the last question. We talked about the progressive or the radical left at the moment and identity politics and now we are back in the working class. Who's gonna fight their fight? The angry worker when the young intellectuals are not aware of the society and the political currents that cause that life? There is no single I
Slavoj Žižek
I still think here I tend to agree which that today it's the elements of old working class are almost privileged if you have a permanent job. It means you may be exploited but you have a job, healthcare blah blah. We should include into the struggle these precarious workers,
I still think here I tend to agree which that today it's the elements of old working class are almost privileged if you have a permanent job. It means you may be exploited but you have a job, healthcare blah blah. We should include into the struggle these precarious workers,
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permanently unemployed. Then my good friend, I admire him, Alvaro Garcia Linera, the vice president in Bolivia of Morales. He told me that they discovered that you have the working class traditional but then you have
permanently unemployed. Then my good friend, I admire him, Alvaro Garcia Linera, the vice president in Bolivia of Morales. He told me that they discovered that you have the working class traditional but then you have
Slavoj Žižek
an extreme number of these how shall I call it, invisible working class. Illegal housemaids, servants and so on. All these have to be brought together if not we are lost. That would be my idea. Don't fetishize the old working class. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Vielen Dank, Genossin. Vielen Dank, Genossin. Okay now what... Slavoj, Slavoj, muček moram, I have to say a few words for the end.
an extreme number of these how shall I call it, invisible working class. Illegal housemaids, servants and so on. All these have to be brought together if not we are lost. That would be my idea. Don't fetishize the old working class. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Vielen Dank, Genossin. Vielen Dank, Genossin. Okay now what... Slavoj, Slavoj, muček moram, I have to say a few words for the end.
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Yeah. Just to finish the show. Can I? Natürlich. You want you want me to be the boss? You said I have to... Ich bin extrem liberal, bist du die? Extrem liberal. So Slavoj, I thank you for this parforce-Ritt or how do you call that? It was a pleasure to have you on Freedom Deluxe and I just recommend that everybody should read his new book, read his texts and there is a lot of interesting
Yeah. Just to finish the show. Can I? Natürlich. You want you want me to be the boss? You said I have to... Ich bin extrem liberal, bist du die? Extrem liberal. So Slavoj, I thank you for this parforce-Ritt or how do you call that? It was a pleasure to have you on Freedom Deluxe and I just recommend that everybody should read his new book, read his texts and there is a lot of interesting
Slavoj Žižek
texts also about the Ukraine about the way the countries in Africa are reacting to creating. There's a lot of provocation, thousand things that we could have talked about and I'm very glad you were here and I hope we caused a little bit of perplexity and distress to some of our listeners. I would say just this, self-critically I agree with you and I would say... What? If you don't have any
texts also about the Ukraine about the way the countries in Africa are reacting to creating. There's a lot of provocation, thousand things that we could have talked about and I'm very glad you were here and I hope we caused a little bit of perplexity and distress to some of our listeners. I would say just this, self-critically I agree with you and I would say... What? If you don't have any
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great love interest that you're passionate, or if you don't have any very good movie or TV series that you want to see, then maybe on the third place you can take a look at my book. I prefer the first two. I recommend. Thank you for
great love interest that you're passionate, or if you don't have any very good movie or TV series that you want to see, then maybe on the third place you can take a look at my book. I prefer the first two. I recommend. Thank you for
Slavoj Žižek
being here Slavoj. Thank you and I hope we will repeat it sometime, you know. I hope so too. I hope so too. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. It's a new dawn, it's a new day, it's a new life for me. Freiheit Deluxe mit Jagoda Marinić ist eine Produktion des Hessischen Rundfunks in Zusammenarbeit mit dem Börsenverein des Deutschen Buchhandels. Alle Tage unter anderem in der ARD Audiothek. Hallo, ich bin Anna Engelke. Und ich bin Kai Küstner. In unserem Podcast Streitkräfte und Strategien schauen wir auf
being here Slavoj. Thank you and I hope we will repeat it sometime, you know. I hope so too. I hope so too. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. It's a new dawn, it's a new day, it's a new life for me. Freiheit Deluxe mit Jagoda Marinić ist eine Produktion des Hessischen Rundfunks in Zusammenarbeit mit dem Börsenverein des Deutschen Buchhandels. Alle Tage unter anderem in der ARD Audiothek. Hallo, ich bin Anna Engelke. Und ich bin Kai Küstner. In unserem Podcast Streitkräfte und Strategien schauen wir auf
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den
den
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Krieg gegen die Ukraine.
Krieg gegen die Ukraine.
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Verändern die Kampfpanzer aus dem Westen jetzt den Krieg? Wie reagiert Russland auf die Offensive?
Verändern die Kampfpanzer aus dem Westen jetzt den Krieg? Wie reagiert Russland auf die Offensive?
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Und welche Interessen hat eigentlich China? Wir ordnen die Nachrichten ein und reden in unserem Podcast mit sicherheitspolitischen Experten.
Und welche Interessen hat eigentlich China? Wir ordnen die Nachrichten ein und reden in unserem Podcast mit sicherheitspolitischen Experten.
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Hört gerne rein bei Streitkräfte und Strategien, zum Beispiel in der ARD Audiothek.
Hört gerne rein bei Streitkräfte und Strategien, zum Beispiel in der ARD Audiothek.