Slavoj Žižek on Cuba after Castro: It's like a cartoon cat suddenly noticing the chasm beneath him
Interview · FRANCE 24 English ·
2016-11-28 · 0:04:22 · 643 words
communism-socialismideologygeopolitics-warhistory
Žižek argues that the fall of communism in 1990 was not a surprise, citing the election of Kwaśniewski over Wałęsa in Poland as evidence of communism's persistence. He critiques Cuba and ex-Yugoslavia as tragic examples of being 'caught in another person's dream,' specifically Castro's and Western leftist fantasies, rather than offering a viable model for 21st-century socialism. He concludes that despite heroic resistance to US pressure, these regimes represent inert remnants of the past, characterized by a contradiction between revolutionary sublime rhetoric and daily misery.
every located moment in this recording, click one to read it
The ideas in it 4
in the order they first come up; click a row for what he does with the idea here
The political event (communism's collapse) functioning as the literal enactment of a philosophical or psychological structure (the cat falling only when looking down).
A state of political existence where a population's reality is defined by the ideological fantasy of an external actor (e.g., Castro or Western leftists), leading to their loss of autonomous political agency.
A political regime that persists not as a forward-looking model for emancipation, but as a stagnant leftover of a past historical epoch.
The grand, maximalist ideological rhetoric of leadership and resistance that masks the mundane reality of inertia and misery in daily life.
Stories he reaches for 1
Žižek contrasts the 'revolutionary sublime' of leadership with the reality of daily life in Cuba, characterized by inertia, misery, and escapism through drugs, sex, and pleasures.
“On the other hand, look at the daily life in Cuba. Inertia, misery, escapism in drugs, in sex, in pleasures and so on and so on.”
People invoked 4
Mentioned as the post-communist candidate who won the 1995 Polish election, used as factual evidence for the persistence of communism.
Fidel Castro negative
Referenced as the source of 'Castro's dream' in which Cuba was caught; Žižek expresses sympathy for the 'heroic resistance' but critiques the regime as a tragic error.
Gilles Deleuze positive
Cited as 'the great French philosopher' for a phrase Žižek calls 'wonderful' to support his argument about being caught in another's dream.
Mentioned as the candidate defeated by Kwaśniewski, serving as a marker of the post-communist political landscape.
Transcript 8 turns
Interviewer
You've lived through the Cold War, the fall of the Soviet Union, the disintegration of Yugoslavia. Did you think that in 2016 there would still be a Castro in power in Havana?
You've lived through the Cold War, the fall of the Soviet Union, the disintegration of Yugoslavia. Did you think that in 2016 there would still be a Castro in power in Havana?
Slavoj Žižek
No, I didn't, but let me add two points. First, you know, there are so many surprise for me. The big surprise was not that. Communism disintegrated in 1990. People usually say who would have imagined this happened even 10 years earlier but who would have imagined that five years afterwards in 1995 you remember post-communist candidate Kwaśniewski won over Lech Wałęsa So in this sense, the persistence of communism is not a surprise. But nonetheless, I think with all the pathetics of fidelity to revolution, resisting United States pressure, and so on and so on, I think all of this is nonetheless. a realization of a very sad metaphor. We all know from cartoons this classic scene of a cat walks across the precipice and goes on walking in the empty air and then it falls down only when it looks down and notices that there is no earth beneath its feet. Isn't there something the same going on in Cuba? The revolution is
No, I didn't, but let me add two points. First, you know, there are so many surprise for me. The big surprise was not that. Communism disintegrated in 1990. People usually say who would have imagined this happened even 10 years earlier but who would have imagined that five years afterwards in 1995 you remember post-communist candidate Kwaśniewski won over Lech Wałęsa So in this sense, the persistence of communism is not a surprise. But nonetheless, I think with all the pathetics of fidelity to revolution, resisting United States pressure, and so on and so on, I think all of this is nonetheless. a realization of a very sad metaphor. We all know from cartoons this classic scene of a cat walks across the precipice and goes on walking in the empty air and then it falls down only when it looks down and notices that there is no earth beneath its feet. Isn't there something the same going on in Cuba? The revolution is
Interviewer
It's been going on for a long time. And I don't know what it's like where you are in Slovenia, but here in France, it really has been a throwback Monday. The fault lines, the classical old school fault lines between the right and the left are back in the coverage of this particular story. Is it the same where you are?
It's been going on for a long time. And I don't know what it's like where you are in Slovenia, but here in France, it really has been a throwback Monday. The fault lines, the classical old school fault lines between the right and the left are back in the coverage of this particular story. Is it the same where you are?
Slavoj Žižek
No, I think our reaction is more one of indifference. And I even think this is the right reaction. Because I think that the tragedy of Cuba was, well, let me tell you a wonderful phrase of the great French philosopher Gilles Deleuze. Si vous êtes pris dans le rêve de l'autre, vous êtes foutu. If you are caught into another person's dream, you are lost. Isn't this what happened with Cuba? People there were living in misery, inertia, but Their country was caught in other person's dreams. Castro's dream, the dream of West European leftists and so on. And that was the tragedy not only of Cuba, but also of ex-Yugoslavia, these countries which were not the same real socialist countries as the grey East European dictatorships. So with European leftists like them as a dream of, you know, maybe this is a different authentic revolution and so on and so on. Unfortunately, in the case of my own ex-Yugoslavia, as well as in the case of Cuba, I don't think there was a difference. With all my sympathy for Cuba, heroic resistance to United States pressure and so on and so on, what ultimately matters for me as the one who is still a convinced radical leftist is simply Did Cuba provide something that at least can serve as a kind of a model project for what a new socialism for 21st century should be or was it just a nostalgic inert remainder of the past? I think unfortunately there is no potential for future emancipation.
No, I think our reaction is more one of indifference. And I even think this is the right reaction. Because I think that the tragedy of Cuba was, well, let me tell you a wonderful phrase of the great French philosopher Gilles Deleuze. Si vous êtes pris dans le rêve de l'autre, vous êtes foutu. If you are caught into another person's dream, you are lost. Isn't this what happened with Cuba? People there were living in misery, inertia, but Their country was caught in other person's dreams. Castro's dream, the dream of West European leftists and so on. And that was the tragedy not only of Cuba, but also of ex-Yugoslavia, these countries which were not the same real socialist countries as the grey East European dictatorships. So with European leftists like them as a dream of, you know, maybe this is a different authentic revolution and so on and so on. Unfortunately, in the case of my own ex-Yugoslavia, as well as in the case of Cuba, I don't think there was a difference. With all my sympathy for Cuba, heroic resistance to United States pressure and so on and so on, what ultimately matters for me as the one who is still a convinced radical leftist is simply Did Cuba provide something that at least can serve as a kind of a model project for what a new socialism for 21st century should be or was it just a nostalgic inert remainder of the past? I think unfortunately there is no potential for future emancipation.
Interviewer
Just one final question on this. Our correspondent earlier, we spoke to him in Havana. He said, young Cubans, they have no illusions about the way their country is run, and yet they feel genuine sorrow. 90%, he said, of those he's been speaking to this weekend.
Just one final question on this. Our correspondent earlier, we spoke to him in Havana. He said, young Cubans, they have no illusions about the way their country is run, and yet they feel genuine sorrow. 90%, he said, of those he's been speaking to this weekend.
Slavoj Žižek
Yeah, but for me I see as a nonetheless a trained psychoanalyst, no problem in this. These two sides go together. On the one hand, this revolutionary sublime, maximal leader and so on. On the other hand, look at the daily life in Cuba. Inertia, misery, escapism in drugs, in sex, in pleasures and so on and so on. That's the reality of the revolutionary sublime.
Yeah, but for me I see as a nonetheless a trained psychoanalyst, no problem in this. These two sides go together. On the one hand, this revolutionary sublime, maximal leader and so on. On the other hand, look at the daily life in Cuba. Inertia, misery, escapism in drugs, in sex, in pleasures and so on and so on. That's the reality of the revolutionary sublime.
Interviewer
Slavoj Žižek, many thanks for joining us from Ljubljana.
Slavoj Žižek, many thanks for joining us from Ljubljana.
Slavoj Žižek
Thank you very much.
Thank you very much.