Slavoj Zizek: Will today’s chaos lead to change for the better? | The Stream
Interview · Al Jazeera English ·
published 2022-01-05 · 0:25:20 · 3,238 words
the date above is when the video was uploaded, no recording date was found
capitalismcommunism-socialismideologydemocracyecology-climatefascism-populismliberalism-political-correctnessrevolution-violenceeconomicsphilosophy-general
On The Stream with Femi Oke (around the anniversary of the January 6 insurrection), Žižek discusses his book Heaven in Disorder and argues that we already live in a permanent state of exception. He reads official climate protest (COP26) and disaster films (Don't Look Up) as empty spectacle masking inaction, frames right-wing populism as a reaction to the failure of the liberal-democratic mainstream, and diagnoses today's capitalism as a corporate/techno neo-feudalism ruled by figures like Musk, Gates, and Bezos. He proposes a 'new communism' as the true 'great reset' and ends on the stance of being 'optimist because pessimist', with no historical guarantee of progress.
every located moment in this recording, click one to read it
The ideas in it 11
in the order they first come up; click a row for what he does with the idea here
His reversal of the question/answer relation: crises are not open questions but imposed answers; the critical task is to reconstruct the question to which the crisis is an answer.
The traps and mystifications built into the very way a topic is approached (e.g. framing racism as a problem of tolerance) that philosophy must interrogate.
The social order of customs and unwritten rules that tells us how to apply explicit rules; Žižek says it is precisely what is disintegrating today, leaving no shared orientation.
as “state of exception”
The crisis condition he says we already permanently inhabit; the pandemic did not inaugurate it but the system learned to metabolize it.
as “catch-up revolution”
Older protests (Belarus, Russia) demanding to catch up to the developed West; contrasted with the new wave (Podemos, Yellow Vests) that expresses dissatisfaction with the developed liberal-democratic system itself.
as “corporate neo-feudalism”
His reframing of today's capitalism: techno/corporate overlords (Musk, Gates, Bezos) function as feudal lords controlling a territory and extracting rent rather than as old-fashioned capitalists.
as “un-freedom experienced as freedom”
The most dangerous form of un-freedom is the one in which subjects still experience themselves as free, unaware of how tightly they are controlled and manipulated, the condition he diagnoses in the US/West.
as “new communism”
His name for an order in which the already-publicly-acknowledged necessities (socialized healthcare, global climate cooperation, long-term planning beyond the election cycle) could actually be met; explicitly not 20th-century central planning.
as “fascism”
Following Walter Benjamin, a sign or symptom of a failed revolution; today's right-wing regressions are big capital acting in advance to block a leftist turn.
His stance: pessimism means no guarantee history turns toward the better; optimism means that despite catastrophe, authentic miracles still happen, only by abandoning the guarantee can one act.
as “Heaven in Disorder”
His title-image for the collapse of the general worldview: even when the world is in chaos, the shared 'heaven' of orientation, values and customs used to stay intact, now it too is in disorder.
Stories he reaches for 3
The Glasgow meeting on global warming was all empty phrases, a spectacle staged to mask the fact that we are not yet ready to do anything about climate change.
“All this spectacle was here to mask the fact that we are not yet ready really to do something.”
A new wave of protests (Podemos in Spain, the Yellow Vests in France) expresses dissatisfaction with the developed liberal-democratic system itself, a negative energy of protest that cannot be translated into existing multi-party political forms.
“This is a negative energy, energy of protest which cannot be translated into the existing political forms of multi-party democracy.”
In Auschwitz there circulated a whole series of Jewish jokes about Auschwitz itself; when things are truly desperate and tragic, only comedy can do the work, because the dignified serious role fails and humor is needed to survive.
“in Auschwitz, Auschwitz, there was a whole series of Jewish jokes about it.”
Works invoked 3
Don't Look Up film
Praised as 'a very good movie'; deployed to illustrate how even protest functions as an empty spectacle when participants know nothing will change.
Heaven in Disorder book
His own book (Dec 2021) whose title-concept names the collapse of the shared general worldview; the framework from which the whole interview unfolds.
Troubles in Our Paradise essay
The third essay of Heaven in Disorder, on the 'Leninist task' of converting big protests and dissatisfaction into a coordinated movement; raised by the audience questioner Hussein.
People invoked 8
Vladimir Lenin positive
Referenced through the 'Leninist task' of transforming big protests and dissatisfaction into a coordinated movement (the essay 'Troubles in Our Paradise' in Heaven in Disorder).
Donald Trump negative
The 'Trump counter-revolution' / 'Trump-oriented Republicans' embody the right-wing populist reaction to the failure of the liberal-democratic mainstream and the breakdown of shared political language.
Jeff Bezos negative
Grouped with Musk and Gates as a feudal-type corporate overlord of the new capitalism.
Elon Musk negative
Named alongside Gates and Bezos as a new feudal master controlling a territory and extracting rent rather than an old-fashioned capitalist.
Bill Gates negative
Grouped with Musk and Bezos as a corporate figure of the 'great reset' and as a new-style feudal master.
Walter Benjamin positive
Named 'one of my favourite theorists'; his dictum that every fascism is a sign of a failed revolution is deployed to read current right-wing regressions as capital blocking a leftist turn.
Martin Luther King Jr. positive
Invoked as never having spoken of tolerance, to refute the liberal reduction of racism to a discourse of tolerance.
Karl Marx positive
Cited via thesis eleven on Feuerbach; Žižek inverts it, arguing that after the 20th century we changed the world too much and must now interpret it more.
What it argues
Heaven in disorder: the disintegration of the big OtherProtest as empty spectacle masking inactionRight-wing populism as reaction to liberal-democratic failureCorporate neo-feudalism replacing old capitalismNew communism as the true 'great reset'Optimism grounded in pessimismAnswers before questions: the task of philosophy
Dialectical moves 6
“I get answers and then literally I have to think to what question this answer is an answer.”
The question/answer relation is reversed: answers arrive first, and the labour of thought is to reconstruct the question they answer.
“Crises are not just questions. Crises are answers to problems.”
A crisis is not an open question but an imposed answer; critique must recover the question to which the crisis is the answer.
“We talk about it precisely in order not to do it.”
Far from discourse being a prelude to action, public talk of action functions as its substitute.
“The most dangerous form of un-freedom is the un-freedom where you still experience yourself as free.”
True unfreedom appears as its opposite, freedom experienced from within, since the subject is unaware of the control.
“I'm paradoxically here optimist because I am a pessimist.”
Optimism is grounded in pessimism: only by giving up the guarantee of progress can authentic action and miracle still be possible.
“Maybe in the 20th century we tried to change the world too much, now we have to interpret it more.”
Marx's thesis eleven is inverted: today the excess lies in changing, so interpretation becomes the revolutionary task.
Claims 17
asserts
The task of philosophy and critical thinking today is not to give answers but to ask the right questions.philosophy / critical thinking
asserts
Crises are not questions but answers to problems; the difficulty is to ask the right question.crisis / question
rejects
Reducing racism to a problem of tolerance is a liberal ideological trap that already misperceives the problem from the standpoint of free-choice individualism.racism / tolerance
asserts
The big Other — the shared social order of customs and unwritten rules — is disintegrating, leaving less and less shared space of communication and values.the big Other / social order
asserts
Democracy requires not just difference but agreement on basic shared values and principles that allow coexistence in the same space.democracy
asserts
We are already living in a permanent state of exception; the pandemic did not create something new but the system found a way to react to it.state of exception
rejects
Official calls to act on climate change such as the Glasgow COP26 summit are empty phrases, a spectacle masking that we are not ready to do anything.climate protest / COP26
reframes
We talk about acting on crises precisely in order to avoid acting.protest / inaction
reframes
Right-wing populism, including the January 6 insurrection, is a reaction to the failure of the liberal-democratic mainstream rather than a purely external eruption.populism / January 6
reframes
Today's capitalism is so transformed it should no longer be called capitalism; it is a corporate/techno neo-feudalism.capitalism / neo-feudalism
asserts
Figures like Musk, Gates, and Bezos operate as feudal lords controlling a territory and extracting rent, not as old-fashioned capitalists.tech billionaires / class
asserts
The most dangerous unfreedom is one in which subjects still experience themselves as free.freedom / ideology
reframes
The 'great reset' is already underway under corporate control; the true reset would be a new communism.great reset / communism
asserts
Communism means an order in which publicly acknowledged necessities — socialized healthcare, global climate cooperation, long-term planning beyond elections — could actually be met.communism
asserts
Every fascism is a sign of a failed revolution (Walter Benjamin); current right-wing regressions are big capital acting in advance to prevent a leftist turn.fascism / failed revolution
asserts
History is moving toward catastrophe, not toward a better future; progress is not guaranteed.history / progress
reframes
Marx's thesis eleven must be inverted for today: in the 20th century we changed the world too much, so now the task is to interpret it more.Marx / interpretation vs change
Quotes 11
“I prefer the most dangerous philosopher in the West although it was meant as a critique. This Elvis stuff, it's stupid.”Slavoj Žižek · embracing the 'dangerous' label
“When things are really desperate and tragic, do you know that only comedy can do the work?”Slavoj Žižek · comedy in desperate times
“I am not searching for answers. I am reading things, observing them, and then all of a sudden it strikes me.”Slavoj Žižek · answers before questions
“Crises are answers to problems. Crises are not just questions. And the difficult thing is to ask the right question.”Slavoj Žižek · crisis as imposed answer
“Democracy is not just about differences. Democracy also means that we should all agree upon certain basic values, principles and so on which allow us to coexist within the same space.”Slavoj Žižek · democracy needs shared values
“We talk about it precisely in order not to do it.”Slavoj Žižek · discourse as substitute for action
“the most dangerous form of un-freedom is the un-freedom where you still experience yourself as free.”Slavoj Žižek · ideology of felt freedom
“every fascism is a sign of a failed revolution.”Slavoj Žižek · Benjamin's formula on fascism
“I'm paradoxically here optimist because I am a pessimist.”Slavoj Žižek · optimism through pessimism
“History is not on our side. History is moving towards a catastrophe. We have to act.”Slavoj Žižek · no guarantee of progress
“Maybe in the 20th century we tried to change the world too much, now we have to interpret it more.”Slavoj Žižek · inverting Marx's thesis 11
Transcript 27 turns
unknown
Hi, I’m Femi Oke. Today on The Stream, the very first episode for Happy New Year, thank you for joining me. Also joining us, the philosopher and cultural theorist Slavoj Žižek. It’s so nice to have you here, Slavoj. Welcome to The Stream. People delight in giving you titles and describing you. A couple of descriptions: celebrity philosopher, most dangerous philosopher in the West, and this one, it tickles me but I have no idea what it means, Elvis of cultural theory. Out of all of the titles you’ve been given over the years, which one do you embrace the most, which one do you love?
Hi, I’m Femi Oke. Today on The Stream, the very first episode for Happy New Year, thank you for joining me. Also joining us, the philosopher and cultural theorist Slavoj Žižek. It’s so nice to have you here, Slavoj. Welcome to The Stream. People delight in giving you titles and describing you. A couple of descriptions: celebrity philosopher, most dangerous philosopher in the West, and this one, it tickles me but I have no idea what it means, Elvis of cultural theory. Out of all of the titles you’ve been given over the years, which one do you embrace the most, which one do you love?
Slavoj Žižek
I prefer the most dangerous philosopher in the West although it was meant as a critique. This Elvis stuff, it’s stupid. I think it’s an excuse for the people not to take me seriously. The idea is, oh, you will hear some jokes from him but don’t expect too much. No, I—my basic thoughts are very serious. So very briefly, why do I like to give a comic twist to it? Well, we live in a very dangerous time. And when things are really desperate and tragic, do you know that only comedy can do the work? From my Jewish friends I learned that in Auschwitz, Auschwitz, there was a whole series of Jewish jokes about it. So, you see my point? When things are desperate, they are too horrible to take them seriously, to play the dignified role, you need humor to survive.
I prefer the most dangerous philosopher in the West although it was meant as a critique. This Elvis stuff, it’s stupid. I think it’s an excuse for the people not to take me seriously. The idea is, oh, you will hear some jokes from him but don’t expect too much. No, I—my basic thoughts are very serious. So very briefly, why do I like to give a comic twist to it? Well, we live in a very dangerous time. And when things are really desperate and tragic, do you know that only comedy can do the work? From my Jewish friends I learned that in Auschwitz, Auschwitz, there was a whole series of Jewish jokes about it. So, you see my point? When things are desperate, they are too horrible to take them seriously, to play the dignified role, you need humor to survive.
unknown
Slavoj, I have an image of you as a young boy, not asking why, but giving up ideas and suggestions. So most little kids are why is the sky blue, why is this, why does this happen? I kind of reversed it and you’re telling other people what the answer is. As a young philosopher, what drove you into that interest about knowledge and ideas and how to explain our world?
Slavoj, I have an image of you as a young boy, not asking why, but giving up ideas and suggestions. So most little kids are why is the sky blue, why is this, why does this happen? I kind of reversed it and you’re telling other people what the answer is. As a young philosopher, what drove you into that interest about knowledge and ideas and how to explain our world?
Slavoj Žižek
That’s a very nice question. My work operates almost in the opposite sense. I am not searching for answers. I am reading things, observing them, and then all of a sudden it strikes me. I—in my mind, I get answers and then literally I have to think to what question this answer is an answer. This is what is happening to us today, I think. We are given answers all the time. Crises are answers to problems. Crises are not just questions. And the difficult thing is to ask the right question. And that’s the task of critical thinking and philosophy today. It’s not so much to give answers. What can I as a philosopher say about, I don’t know, ecological crisis? This is for specialists and so on. But what I can do is interrogate or examine how do we approach this topic. Are there ideological traps in—or mystifications in the very way we approach this topic? For example, brief one, racism. I noticed that lately we automatically identify racism or try to reduce it to the topic of tolerance. We should tolerate each other and so on and so on. No, this is not the true problem of racism. Martin Luther King never spoke of tolerance and so on. So you see, if we define the problem of racism as the problem of tolerance, we are already perceiving the problem from the standpoint of this late liberal obsession with free choices and so on and so on. That’s what I can do. Not give answers, but ask the right questions. Slavoj, so whether people want to ask you the right questions or give you some answers, I am sharing you with our online audience right now. So if they’re on YouTube,
That’s a very nice question. My work operates almost in the opposite sense. I am not searching for answers. I am reading things, observing them, and then all of a sudden it strikes me. I—in my mind, I get answers and then literally I have to think to what question this answer is an answer. This is what is happening to us today, I think. We are given answers all the time. Crises are answers to problems. Crises are not just questions. And the difficult thing is to ask the right question. And that’s the task of critical thinking and philosophy today. It’s not so much to give answers. What can I as a philosopher say about, I don’t know, ecological crisis? This is for specialists and so on. But what I can do is interrogate or examine how do we approach this topic. Are there ideological traps in—or mystifications in the very way we approach this topic? For example, brief one, racism. I noticed that lately we automatically identify racism or try to reduce it to the topic of tolerance. We should tolerate each other and so on and so on. No, this is not the true problem of racism. Martin Luther King never spoke of tolerance and so on. So you see, if we define the problem of racism as the problem of tolerance, we are already perceiving the problem from the standpoint of this late liberal obsession with free choices and so on and so on. That’s what I can do. Not give answers, but ask the right questions. Slavoj, so whether people want to ask you the right questions or give you some answers, I am sharing you with our online audience right now. So if they’re on YouTube,
unknown
the comment section is right here. You can comment on Slavoj’s philosophy, his approach to life, how he unpacks life. You can do it in the next minutes, so get online as soon as you can, ask your questions and I will share them with our guest. Let’s start with your recent book published in December. It is called Heaven in Disorder. For me, it feels like a collection of articles and essays in the way that you are unpacking the world and taking us through very contemporary issues. How do you see that book? Who is it for?
the comment section is right here. You can comment on Slavoj’s philosophy, his approach to life, how he unpacks life. You can do it in the next minutes, so get online as soon as you can, ask your questions and I will share them with our guest. Let’s start with your recent book published in December. It is called Heaven in Disorder. For me, it feels like a collection of articles and essays in the way that you are unpacking the world and taking us through very contemporary issues. How do you see that book? Who is it for?
Slavoj Žižek
Well, the key dimension of what I wanted to develop in this book is indicated already by the title. Heaven in Disorder means that even when there is chaos in our world, usually for more traditional views, Marxism included, heaven remains in order. Heaven, I don’t mean it in a theological sense, I mean it more in a simple sense of a general worldview. Like even when there is a crisis, Marxists claim that we know where history is moving towards a brighter future, we just have to act according to history and so on and so on, to higher historical laws and so on. But I think that today the mess is much more dangerous. Heaven itself is in disorder in the sense that we are lacking more and more, how should I call it, general orientation. There is no—there is less and less space of shared communication. We no longer share values, customs, attitudes and so on and so on. And this is important, I think, especially in a society which perceives itself as democratic. Democracy is not just about differences. Democracy also means that we should all agree upon certain basic values, principles and so on which allow us to coexist within the same space. What is happening now, not only in Europe but especially in the United States, is that heaven is in disorder in the sense of we have now Trump-oriented Republicans, they are more and more talking a different language from with regard to democratic majority and so on and so on. There is no dialogue here. And I think this is not just something that happens in the developed West, it is more and more happening everywhere. That more and more our—you know what is falling apart? I will give you a very brief answer. Don’t be afraid. Okay. What is slowly disintegrating is what we philosophers call the big Other, social order of customs, unwritten rules. You know, rules are never just rules. Every network of rules that you have to obey to belong a certain social space involves kind of a deeper rules which tell you how to apply rules. This always fascinated me. For example, let’s say I’m—this is not probably true—I’m richer than you, I invite you to dinner. We know in advance that I will pay. But when the bill arrives, you are expected to say no, I will pay, or let’s share it and so on and so on, but it’s clear that it’s just an empty gesture. At the end, I will pay. And this is how politics works. Often you make an offer which is meant to be rejected or you solicit something but it’s just
Well, the key dimension of what I wanted to develop in this book is indicated already by the title. Heaven in Disorder means that even when there is chaos in our world, usually for more traditional views, Marxism included, heaven remains in order. Heaven, I don’t mean it in a theological sense, I mean it more in a simple sense of a general worldview. Like even when there is a crisis, Marxists claim that we know where history is moving towards a brighter future, we just have to act according to history and so on and so on, to higher historical laws and so on. But I think that today the mess is much more dangerous. Heaven itself is in disorder in the sense that we are lacking more and more, how should I call it, general orientation. There is no—there is less and less space of shared communication. We no longer share values, customs, attitudes and so on and so on. And this is important, I think, especially in a society which perceives itself as democratic. Democracy is not just about differences. Democracy also means that we should all agree upon certain basic values, principles and so on which allow us to coexist within the same space. What is happening now, not only in Europe but especially in the United States, is that heaven is in disorder in the sense of we have now Trump-oriented Republicans, they are more and more talking a different language from with regard to democratic majority and so on and so on. There is no dialogue here. And I think this is not just something that happens in the developed West, it is more and more happening everywhere. That more and more our—you know what is falling apart? I will give you a very brief answer. Don’t be afraid. Okay. What is slowly disintegrating is what we philosophers call the big Other, social order of customs, unwritten rules. You know, rules are never just rules. Every network of rules that you have to obey to belong a certain social space involves kind of a deeper rules which tell you how to apply rules. This always fascinated me. For example, let’s say I’m—this is not probably true—I’m richer than you, I invite you to dinner. We know in advance that I will pay. But when the bill arrives, you are expected to say no, I will pay, or let’s share it and so on and so on, but it’s clear that it’s just an empty gesture. At the end, I will pay. And this is how politics works. Often you make an offer which is meant to be rejected or you solicit something but it’s just
unknown
an
an
Slavoj Žižek
empty form. Slavoj, take a pause for a moment
empty form. Slavoj, take a pause for a moment
unknown
because earlier we spoke to Hussein who has read Heaven in Disorder. He has been following your work for the last decade and he has a question for you. Listen to the video and then immediately answer Hussein. Here he is.
because earlier we spoke to Hussein who has read Heaven in Disorder. He has been following your work for the last decade and he has a question for you. Listen to the video and then immediately answer Hussein. Here he is.
unknown
Heaven in Disorder should be a call for action, I believe, for the day after tomorrow. As he himself would like all of us to think after big protests and movements. Žižek writes in the third essay, Troubles in Our Paradise, about the Leninist task which lies ahead about like transforming big protests and movement and growing dissatisfaction into a coordinated movement. So my question would be to Slavoj, are we already not living in societies of permanent state of exception, chaos, emergencies and civil unrest? And have we not normalized it permanently to live under these disturbing shadows? I hope it’s not a new normal for us.
Heaven in Disorder should be a call for action, I believe, for the day after tomorrow. As he himself would like all of us to think after big protests and movements. Žižek writes in the third essay, Troubles in Our Paradise, about the Leninist task which lies ahead about like transforming big protests and movement and growing dissatisfaction into a coordinated movement. So my question would be to Slavoj, are we already not living in societies of permanent state of exception, chaos, emergencies and civil unrest? And have we not normalized it permanently to live under these disturbing shadows? I hope it’s not a new normal for us.
Slavoj Žižek
It’s a very good, appropriate question. Yes, we are already living in a permanent state of exception. I don’t think the pandemic in this regard was something really new. But I think that the system already found a way to react to it. We get calls for action which are in themselves not meant to be taken seriously. Like—did—I hope many of us saw the movie Don’t Look Up. It’s I think a very good movie because it shows how even those people who think look up, protest and so on and so on, it’s an empty spectacle. They know somehow nothing will really change. I think the same can be said about the Glasgow meeting a couple of months ago against—how to fight
It’s a very good, appropriate question. Yes, we are already living in a permanent state of exception. I don’t think the pandemic in this regard was something really new. But I think that the system already found a way to react to it. We get calls for action which are in themselves not meant to be taken seriously. Like—did—I hope many of us saw the movie Don’t Look Up. It’s I think a very good movie because it shows how even those people who think look up, protest and so on and so on, it’s an empty spectacle. They know somehow nothing will really change. I think the same can be said about the Glasgow meeting a couple of months ago against—how to fight
unknown
global warming. COP26. Sure. These were all empty phrases. All this
global warming. COP26. Sure. These were all empty phrases. All this
Slavoj Žižek
spectacle was here to mask the fact that we are not yet ready really to do something. Slavoj, I have so many questions for you. We’re not yet ready to do something. We talk about it but we’re not doing the action. No, it’s even more paradoxical. Really? Go ahead. That we talk about it precisely in order not to do it. Oh, okay. All right. So this is Alex Smith. He wants to know what you think about the events—we’re at the anniversary of January the 6th, the insurrection in the United States. And I want to add onto that the state of US democracy and also as a global power how we should navigate the US going forward. So starting with the insurrection and we’re basically talking
spectacle was here to mask the fact that we are not yet ready really to do something. Slavoj, I have so many questions for you. We’re not yet ready to do something. We talk about it but we’re not doing the action. No, it’s even more paradoxical. Really? Go ahead. That we talk about it precisely in order not to do it. Oh, okay. All right. So this is Alex Smith. He wants to know what you think about the events—we’re at the anniversary of January the 6th, the insurrection in the United States. And I want to add onto that the state of US democracy and also as a global power how we should navigate the US going forward. So starting with the insurrection and we’re basically talking
unknown
about US policy. Yes. Okay, it’s easy to condemn the so-called insurrection, whatever, attack on Capitol as a populist uprising and so on and so on. I think—and to criticize it as a right-wing coup. I think, of course I condemn it, but we should never forget that the entire right-wing populist movement, Trump counter-revolution, however you call it,
about US policy. Yes. Okay, it’s easy to condemn the so-called insurrection, whatever, attack on Capitol as a populist uprising and so on and so on. I think—and to criticize it as a right-wing coup. I think, of course I condemn it, but we should never forget that the entire right-wing populist movement, Trump counter-revolution, however you call it,
Slavoj Žižek
is a reply, a reaction to the failure of the liberal-democratic mainstream. To give you my general point, what is going on for almost a decade is that we have, even in developed countries, a new type of protests. Till years ago, protests were mostly, let’s say,
is a reply, a reaction to the failure of the liberal-democratic mainstream. To give you my general point, what is going on for almost a decade is that we have, even in developed countries, a new type of protests. Till years ago, protests were mostly, let’s say,
unknown
calls for catch-up revolution. Like people interpret what is going on in Belarus, in Russia, they want to become like the developed West. Now we have a new wave of protests which express dissatisfaction with the very developed liberal-democratic system. Look at Podemos in Spain, Yellow Vests
calls for catch-up revolution. Like people interpret what is going on in Belarus, in Russia, they want to become like the developed West. Now we have a new wave of protests which express dissatisfaction with the very developed liberal-democratic system. Look at Podemos in Spain, Yellow Vests
unknown
in France and so on and so on. This is a negative energy, energy of protest which cannot be translated into the existing political forms of multi-party democracy. And that’s a very dangerous phenomenon. So
in France and so on and so on. This is a negative energy, energy of protest which cannot be translated into the existing political forms of multi-party democracy. And that’s a very dangerous phenomenon. So
Slavoj Žižek
democracy, if it is to survive, will have to be reinvented. Democracy that we have today, it’s not that it’s oppressive, it’s that it simply cannot integrate, give voice to this new discontent that is appearing among the broad public. Slavoj, a question here on YouTube from Josephine Jennifer who’s currently watching you right now. She asks, what is your definition of the great reset in the society and global economy? Are we as a community ready for a great reset? Well, it’s a nice question but my qualification would have been that you know what we usually call the great reset, the formula proposed by some top democratic politicians and big corporate persons and so on, is already happening. What fascinates me is that some stupid leftists still attack neoliberalism. No, sorry, what we are witnessing today is new forms of capitalism which makes today’s capitalism so different from old liberal capitalism that it no longer even should be called maybe capitalism. Some people even talk about techno- or corporate neo-feudalism. The big figures today like Elon Musk, Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and so on, they are much closer to a new form of feudal masters which control an entire territory and to whom we are paying a kind of a rent than to old-fashioned capitalists. This is the problem for me. That it’s not just great reset in the sense of society we live in now cannot go on, we have to change it radically. The problem is that this change is already happening. New forms of social control and so on and so on. And it’s moving in a direction which I find pretty scary. That’s why I’m critical towards the United States also. Because in countries like China, towards which I’m of course radically critical, you at least know you live in an authoritarian controlled society. But in countries like United States and some other developed
democracy, if it is to survive, will have to be reinvented. Democracy that we have today, it’s not that it’s oppressive, it’s that it simply cannot integrate, give voice to this new discontent that is appearing among the broad public. Slavoj, a question here on YouTube from Josephine Jennifer who’s currently watching you right now. She asks, what is your definition of the great reset in the society and global economy? Are we as a community ready for a great reset? Well, it’s a nice question but my qualification would have been that you know what we usually call the great reset, the formula proposed by some top democratic politicians and big corporate persons and so on, is already happening. What fascinates me is that some stupid leftists still attack neoliberalism. No, sorry, what we are witnessing today is new forms of capitalism which makes today’s capitalism so different from old liberal capitalism that it no longer even should be called maybe capitalism. Some people even talk about techno- or corporate neo-feudalism. The big figures today like Elon Musk, Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and so on, they are much closer to a new form of feudal masters which control an entire territory and to whom we are paying a kind of a rent than to old-fashioned capitalists. This is the problem for me. That it’s not just great reset in the sense of society we live in now cannot go on, we have to change it radically. The problem is that this change is already happening. New forms of social control and so on and so on. And it’s moving in a direction which I find pretty scary. That’s why I’m critical towards the United States also. Because in countries like China, towards which I’m of course radically critical, you at least know you live in an authoritarian controlled society. But in countries like United States and some other developed
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Western countries, you still think you are somehow free. And as I always repeat, the most dangerous form of un-freedom is the un-freedom where you still experience yourself as free. You are not even aware how tightly controlled, manipulated you are. That’s
Western countries, you still think you are somehow free. And as I always repeat, the most dangerous form of un-freedom is the un-freedom where you still experience yourself as free. You are not even aware how tightly controlled, manipulated you are. That’s
Slavoj Žižek
what’s happening today. So the true reset would have been something—for me, now I come to this damned word that I provocatively use—communism. Would be what I call new communism. Forget about 20th century and so on and so on. I will give you literally in half a minute the program of this new communism. Just listen to the official media and they are all aware of what is to be done: to get out of the pandemic, to fight global warming. We need in some sense to socialize healthcare, more global cooperation. It’s clear that to fight global warming, market alone cannot do it. We need some kind of social coordination, we need international cooperation and so on and so on. Communism for me is simply an order in which all these demands which are even publicly acknowledged could actually be met. Where again economy would have been somehow socialized, where our public political life would change so that it will not be just elections every two year or whatever, but the ability to make long-term plans or project. We need now to really fight global warming, we need somehow to agree on decisions which are not just till next election but which will decide how we will live for decades in advance and so on and so on. That would have been for me a true great reset. The true one. So Slavoj, I’m thinking part of the great reset is the fact that the entire world is finding itself in a pandemic, so though we have to think about how do we go forward, where do we go to next, even if we normally would not have done so. I have one more thought for you on video and this is from Matt McManus. He is in Canada, he has a question for you. Have a listen to the video and then go ahead and answer Matt. Here he is. Like you, I’m hopeful that the COVID-19 pandemic is actually going to lead a lot of people to move towards progressive and leftist causes. But I’m also a little bit worried that the opposite might happen. Looking historically we can see that in many circumstances people don’t move towards the left in dire circumstances, they move towards the right instead. And I think we can see that in many different parts of the world. So my question for you is why do you think that we’re going to see a movement towards the left given current circumstances? And what do you think we can do as progressives to make sure that we don’t see a transition towards the far right? It’s a very good elementary question. My answer is simply that I definitely don’t think that it’s guaranteed that we will move towards the left. What is happening now, all the regressions that you mentioned, are simply reactions of the big capital, corporations, those in power and so on to the crisis which is coming. They as it were act in advance to prevent the leftist turn. I like to quote here one of my favorite theorists, Walter Benjamin, who said that every fascism is a sign of a failed
what’s happening today. So the true reset would have been something—for me, now I come to this damned word that I provocatively use—communism. Would be what I call new communism. Forget about 20th century and so on and so on. I will give you literally in half a minute the program of this new communism. Just listen to the official media and they are all aware of what is to be done: to get out of the pandemic, to fight global warming. We need in some sense to socialize healthcare, more global cooperation. It’s clear that to fight global warming, market alone cannot do it. We need some kind of social coordination, we need international cooperation and so on and so on. Communism for me is simply an order in which all these demands which are even publicly acknowledged could actually be met. Where again economy would have been somehow socialized, where our public political life would change so that it will not be just elections every two year or whatever, but the ability to make long-term plans or project. We need now to really fight global warming, we need somehow to agree on decisions which are not just till next election but which will decide how we will live for decades in advance and so on and so on. That would have been for me a true great reset. The true one. So Slavoj, I’m thinking part of the great reset is the fact that the entire world is finding itself in a pandemic, so though we have to think about how do we go forward, where do we go to next, even if we normally would not have done so. I have one more thought for you on video and this is from Matt McManus. He is in Canada, he has a question for you. Have a listen to the video and then go ahead and answer Matt. Here he is. Like you, I’m hopeful that the COVID-19 pandemic is actually going to lead a lot of people to move towards progressive and leftist causes. But I’m also a little bit worried that the opposite might happen. Looking historically we can see that in many circumstances people don’t move towards the left in dire circumstances, they move towards the right instead. And I think we can see that in many different parts of the world. So my question for you is why do you think that we’re going to see a movement towards the left given current circumstances? And what do you think we can do as progressives to make sure that we don’t see a transition towards the far right? It’s a very good elementary question. My answer is simply that I definitely don’t think that it’s guaranteed that we will move towards the left. What is happening now, all the regressions that you mentioned, are simply reactions of the big capital, corporations, those in power and so on to the crisis which is coming. They as it were act in advance to prevent the leftist turn. I like to quote here one of my favorite theorists, Walter Benjamin, who said that every fascism is a sign of a failed
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revolution. Again, the progressive potentials are obviously generated by the situation we are in. Again, just think about global warming. What should have been done? Are we aware, for example, that in the next decades, maybe tens, hundreds of millions of people will have to move around, there will
revolution. Again, the progressive potentials are obviously generated by the situation we are in. Again, just think about global warming. What should have been done? Are we aware, for example, that in the next decades, maybe tens, hundreds of millions of people will have to move around, there will
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be food shortages? So we can only survive through more socialized economy, not old communist centralized planification, that would have been a catastrophe, but simply more of this cooperation and so on and so on. And of course the—those in power are counter-acting it. But the important thing to see is that again, they are already
be food shortages? So we can only survive through more socialized economy, not old communist centralized planification, that would have been a catastrophe, but simply more of this cooperation and so on and so on. And of course the—those in power are counter-acting it. But the important thing to see is that again, they are already
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changing society so that we are no longer dealing with the old neoliberal capitalism and so on and so on. So what will happen? I’m a—I’m paradoxically here optimist
changing society so that we are no longer dealing with the old neoliberal capitalism and so on and so on. So what will happen? I’m a—I’m paradoxically here optimist
Slavoj Žižek
because I am a pessimist. What do I mean by this? I’m pessimist in the sense that it’s not guaranteed that thing will take a turn towards the better. They will, they will not. Probably even not. History is not on our side. History is moving towards a catastrophe. We have to act. And the only thing I can say is that unfortunately we haven’t yet reached the point of awakening. We obviously will have to go through even more serious ecological crisis and all other types of social crises. So Slavoj, bearing in mind your quite pessimistic view of the future, I have one more question from YouTube. I want you to answer this as swiftly as you can. Life Giving Woman says, I am curious if because of how you approach the world, does it leave you feeling lonely? And how do you overcome those feelings when it feels like no one but you thinks critically? So what’s the impact of your work on you? First, I’m not afraid of being lonely. I will tell you now something very perverse. I even learned, that’s how I survived the last two years, I’ve even learned somehow to enjoy apathy, you know. Take time to reflect. Maybe we need more of this. Marx said in his famous thesis philosophers have interpreted the world too much, now we have to change it. Maybe in the 20th century we tried to change the world too much, now we have to interpret it more. Don’t be afraid of apparently unproductive thinking. And so my optimism is nonetheless that in spite of all this horror, from time to time authentic miracles are happening. Don’t also forget small but nonetheless
because I am a pessimist. What do I mean by this? I’m pessimist in the sense that it’s not guaranteed that thing will take a turn towards the better. They will, they will not. Probably even not. History is not on our side. History is moving towards a catastrophe. We have to act. And the only thing I can say is that unfortunately we haven’t yet reached the point of awakening. We obviously will have to go through even more serious ecological crisis and all other types of social crises. So Slavoj, bearing in mind your quite pessimistic view of the future, I have one more question from YouTube. I want you to answer this as swiftly as you can. Life Giving Woman says, I am curious if because of how you approach the world, does it leave you feeling lonely? And how do you overcome those feelings when it feels like no one but you thinks critically? So what’s the impact of your work on you? First, I’m not afraid of being lonely. I will tell you now something very perverse. I even learned, that’s how I survived the last two years, I’ve even learned somehow to enjoy apathy, you know. Take time to reflect. Maybe we need more of this. Marx said in his famous thesis philosophers have interpreted the world too much, now we have to change it. Maybe in the 20th century we tried to change the world too much, now we have to interpret it more. Don’t be afraid of apparently unproductive thinking. And so my optimism is nonetheless that in spite of all this horror, from time to time authentic miracles are happening. Don’t also forget small but nonetheless
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remarkable progresses of the left. Killer elections in Bolivia, in Chile, or in the United States. We have now, this is a tremendous shift there, we have now democratic socialism as a legitimate option. You can talk about it, you are not automatically excluded if you advocate it and so
remarkable progresses of the left. Killer elections in Bolivia, in Chile, or in the United States. We have now, this is a tremendous shift there, we have now democratic socialism as a legitimate option. You can talk about it, you are not automatically excluded if you advocate it and so
Slavoj Žižek
on and so on. Slavoj Žižek, can you believe that minutes went so fast? That we still have so much more to get from you. But I’m going to leave it there for now. If you would like to hear more from Slavoj Žižek, I highly recommend his book, Heaven in Disorder, published in December, available now. Thank you, Slavoj, for being part of our show today. Thank you for the excellent questions on YouTube
on and so on. Slavoj Žižek, can you believe that minutes went so fast? That we still have so much more to get from you. But I’m going to leave it there for now. If you would like to hear more from Slavoj Žižek, I highly recommend his book, Heaven in Disorder, published in December, available now. Thank you, Slavoj, for being part of our show today. Thank you for the excellent questions on YouTube
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as well. And the answers on YouTube as well, I see what you did there too. Thanks for watching, I’ll see you next time.
as well. And the answers on YouTube as well, I see what you did there too. Thanks for watching, I’ll see you next time.