Slavoj Žižek interview on NiteBeat
Interview · planetjanet ·
2008-06-25 · 0:05:36 · 917 words
ideologypsychoanalysiseveryday-lifecinema-art-culture
Žižek analyzes a book that seeks to rehabilitate Jacques Lacan by arguing that contemporary 'tolerance' and 'freedom' conceal stricter forms of authority than traditional authoritarianism. He illustrates this through examples of parenting, consumption, and politics, arguing that modern society operates via 'X without Y' logic (e.g., coffee without caffeine, war without casualties). He concludes by defending Lacan’s difficulty as a necessary feature against class-based accusations of elitism.
every located moment in this recording, click one to read it
The ideas in it 4
in the order they first come up; click a row for what he does with the idea here
as “apparent tolerance”
A form of social control that presents itself as free choice but enforces a stricter, internalized obligation (e.g., you must want to visit your grandma).
as “hedonism regulated by duty”
The paradox where the pursuit of pure pleasure/self-actualization requires strict regulation (jogging, diet, non-harassment), resulting in more regulation than traditional duty.
as “X without Y”
A structural logic of contemporary capitalism/ideology where a substance is removed but the form remains (coffee without caffeine, sex without sex, war without casualties), creating a 'reduced form deprived of its substance'.
The accusation that Lacan is 'difficult' is interpreted by Žižek not as a valid critique but as a class-based attack by the 'enemy' (bourgeois/anti-intellectual forces) against high culture.
Stories he reaches for 4
Contrasts an authoritarian father (who commands you to visit grandma) with a tolerant postmodern father (who says you can visit only if you want to). The latter imposes a stronger order: you must not only visit, but like it.
“It's not only you have to visit your grandma, but you have to like it.”
Mentioned as another example of passive consumption and the removal of substance (laughter without the joke/comedy).
“Canned laughter.”
A series of examples of 'products in a reduced form deprived of its substance': coffee without caffeine, pastry without sugar, beer (Denis Leary joke), safe sex (sex without sex), and the Colin Powell doctrine (war without warfare/casualties).
“You can have it all but in a reduced form deprived of its substance.”
A 'vulgar' product bought in California: a chocolate laxative. It encapsulates the logic of 'X without Y' by combining the pleasure of chocolate with the function of a laxative, removing the usual side effect (constipation) while keeping the form.
“In California, I bought it recently: a chocolate laxative.”
Works invoked 1
Žižek is reading a book that aims to rehabilitate Lacan ('make Lacan back into someone whom even your grandmother could understand'). He likes it ('I'm beginning to like this book all the more').
People invoked 3
Colin Powell negative
Referenced via the 'Colin Powell doctrine' (war without casualties for our side) as a negative example of 'X without Y' logic in politics.
Jacques Lacan positive
Žižek defends Lacan against claims that he is 'difficult,' calling such claims 'class propaganda by the enemy.' He appreciates the book's goal to make Lacan understandable ('even your grandmother could understand').
Comedian referenced in a self-deprecating joke about sounding ridiculous when listing examples of 'coffee without caffeine'.
Transcript 17 turns
unknown
Jacques Lacan was a French psychoanalyst. He makes Freud sound like a simple valley girl. Lacan's theory of how the self works is so complicated it makes my teeth hurt to think about it. Slavoj Žižek is a philosopher at the University of Ljubljana, Slovenia (I think I said this fairly close to the way it's pronounced) who has written a book called The Puppet and the Dwarf. The book takes a modern—takes a look at modern Christianity from the viewpoint of Lacanian psychoanalysis or at least that's what I think it's about. Welcome, Mr. Žižek. Did I say—tell me the right way.
Jacques Lacan was a French psychoanalyst. He makes Freud sound like a simple valley girl. Lacan's theory of how the self works is so complicated it makes my teeth hurt to think about it. Slavoj Žižek is a philosopher at the University of Ljubljana, Slovenia (I think I said this fairly close to the way it's pronounced) who has written a book called The Puppet and the Dwarf. The book takes a modern—takes a look at modern Christianity from the viewpoint of Lacanian psychoanalysis or at least that's what I think it's about. Welcome, Mr. Žižek. Did I say—tell me the right way.
Slavoj Žižek
Slavoj Žižek. But again, I prefer it the wrong way. It makes me paranoiac if I hear it the right.
Slavoj Žižek. But again, I prefer it the wrong way. It makes me paranoiac if I hear it the right.
unknown
This is the most complicated book I have ever tried
This is the most complicated book I have ever tried
Slavoj Žižek
to read. Strange because the goal of the book is on the contrary to like make Lacon back into someone whom even your grandmother could understand. So the thrust of the book is not so much Christianity, the basic idea is the following one. Okay. Today there is a certain common agreement that certain things are going on like we need more tolerance, people no longer believe, the era of big ideological—We
to read. Strange because the goal of the book is on the contrary to like make Lacon back into someone whom even your grandmother could understand. So the thrust of the book is not so much Christianity, the basic idea is the following one. Okay. Today there is a certain common agreement that certain things are going on like we need more tolerance, people no longer believe, the era of big ideological—We
unknown
need tolerance and—and on the other hand ideology
need tolerance and—and on the other hand ideology
Slavoj Žižek
is over, who cares about big ideological projects. The third complaint: too much consumption, society of consumption.
is over, who cares about big ideological projects. The third complaint: too much consumption, society of consumption.
unknown
Too much materialism—yeah, materialism and so on and
Too much materialism—yeah, materialism and so on and
Slavoj Žižek
lack of true authority. So these are all things that—that I try to undermine, not in the sense of defending authority, but in the sense of proving how it’s the exact opposite which is going on. Could I give you just an example? For example: authority. Okay. Okay. Let’s say you have an good old-fashioned father. It’s Sunday afternoon, you have to visit grandma. The father, good old-fashioned authoritarian father, will tell you, listen, I don’t care how you feel (if you are a small kid, of course), I don’t care how you feel, you have to go—You're going.—going to grandmother and behave there properly. That’s good, you can resist, nothing is broken. But let’s say you have this so-called tolerant postmodern father. What he will tell you is the following: you know how much your grandmother loves you, but nonetheless you should only visit her if you really want to. Now every child who is not an idiot and they are not idiots know that this apparent free choice secretly contains an even more stronger, much stronger order. It's not only you have to visit your grandma, but you have to like it. I'm beginning to like this book all the more. Yeah, that's one example of how apparent tolerance, choice and so on can conceal a much stronger order. So we should go back to more like
lack of true authority. So these are all things that—that I try to undermine, not in the sense of defending authority, but in the sense of proving how it’s the exact opposite which is going on. Could I give you just an example? For example: authority. Okay. Okay. Let’s say you have an good old-fashioned father. It’s Sunday afternoon, you have to visit grandma. The father, good old-fashioned authoritarian father, will tell you, listen, I don’t care how you feel (if you are a small kid, of course), I don’t care how you feel, you have to go—You're going.—going to grandmother and behave there properly. That’s good, you can resist, nothing is broken. But let’s say you have this so-called tolerant postmodern father. What he will tell you is the following: you know how much your grandmother loves you, but nonetheless you should only visit her if you really want to. Now every child who is not an idiot and they are not idiots know that this apparent free choice secretly contains an even more stronger, much stronger order. It's not only you have to visit your grandma, but you have to like it. I'm beginning to like this book all the more. Yeah, that's one example of how apparent tolerance, choice and so on can conceal a much stronger order. So we should go back to more like
unknown
the dad that just says, because I said so?
the dad that just says, because I said so?
Slavoj Žižek
Absolutely. It’s more honest. Another example: society of consumption. We say, oh, we just only consume today and so on and so on, and no values, no constraints and so on. Ah, one nice paradox. It appears like, you know, today you are allowed to dedicate your life to pleasures, actualizing your true self, who cares about big duties.
Absolutely. It’s more honest. Another example: society of consumption. We say, oh, we just only consume today and so on and so on, and no values, no constraints and so on. Ah, one nice paradox. It appears like, you know, today you are allowed to dedicate your life to pleasures, actualizing your true self, who cares about big duties.
unknown
Build your sense of self-esteem. Yeah,
Build your sense of self-esteem. Yeah,
Slavoj Žižek
but in order to do this—now things get complicated. You have to—you have to do the proper jogging, proper feeding, not to harass others and so on and so on. So the paradox is that the final outcome of this so-called hedonism is that our lives, I claim, are more, more regulated than ever. The final paradox
but in order to do this—now things get complicated. You have to—you have to do the proper jogging, proper feeding, not to harass others and so on and so on. So the paradox is that the final outcome of this so-called hedonism is that our lives, I claim, are more, more regulated than ever. The final paradox
unknown
here—Trying to live healthy is killing
here—Trying to live healthy is killing
Slavoj Žižek
me.—Absolutely. And you know what’s the solution then? The solution is the following one: you can have it all but in a reduced form deprived of its substance. For example: coffee, yes, without caffeine. Sweet pâtisserie, yes, without sugar. Beer, yes—You're kind of Denis Leary from Slovenia. Yeah, yeah, but let’s go on. It’s not only these ridiculous examples. What about safe sex, which means basically sex without sex? What about even, if I may add to this series, the so-called Colin Powell doctrine, which means basically war without warfare, at least for our side, no casualties on our side and so on. I'm beginning to get into this Lacanian stuff. The ultimate—if you ask me, maybe you will not like now my next example. Okay. If there is one product which I think encapsulates this logic—Yeah?—is a kind of a slightly vulgar one. In California, I bought it recently: a chocolate laxative. You know chocolate usually supposed to give you constipation. The idea is, you know, the product—Is that in here? Absolutely. All of—all of this is in there. Okay. So and then there are again numerous other examples. Like people say we are today too—too passive, just passive consumers and so on—We're running out of time. Canned laughter. I want—I want
me.—Absolutely. And you know what’s the solution then? The solution is the following one: you can have it all but in a reduced form deprived of its substance. For example: coffee, yes, without caffeine. Sweet pâtisserie, yes, without sugar. Beer, yes—You're kind of Denis Leary from Slovenia. Yeah, yeah, but let’s go on. It’s not only these ridiculous examples. What about safe sex, which means basically sex without sex? What about even, if I may add to this series, the so-called Colin Powell doctrine, which means basically war without warfare, at least for our side, no casualties on our side and so on. I'm beginning to get into this Lacanian stuff. The ultimate—if you ask me, maybe you will not like now my next example. Okay. If there is one product which I think encapsulates this logic—Yeah?—is a kind of a slightly vulgar one. In California, I bought it recently: a chocolate laxative. You know chocolate usually supposed to give you constipation. The idea is, you know, the product—Is that in here? Absolutely. All of—all of this is in there. Okay. So and then there are again numerous other examples. Like people say we are today too—too passive, just passive consumers and so on—We're running out of time. Canned laughter. I want—I want
unknown
to thank you for being here and I want to thank you for being on Nightbeat, the show that is not afraid to bring you a Lacanian psychoanalytic take on Christianity. It’s all here in the book: the puppet and the—the puppet and
to thank you for being here and I want to thank you for being on Nightbeat, the show that is not afraid to bring you a Lacanian psychoanalytic take on Christianity. It’s all here in the book: the puppet and the—the puppet and
Slavoj Žižek
the dwarf. And as a Marxist, if I may add, if somebody tells that Lacon is difficult, this is class propaganda by the enemy. Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for coming
the dwarf. And as a Marxist, if I may add, if somebody tells that Lacon is difficult, this is class propaganda by the enemy. Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for coming
unknown
in. I never thought I’d have this much fun talking about this. Thank you very much. Have a great weekend. Take care.
in. I never thought I’d have this much fun talking about this. Thank you very much. Have a great weekend. Take care.